Unknown defficiency and some black algae

[fishbone]

I'll take some pictures of this stuff but I wanted to open the thread for now.
Here are some details:
Tank - 10 gallons
Substrate - Eco complete
Lighting: 10w, 8 hours a day from 9:30 AM to 5:30 PM. The tank is next to a window [not in front] and there is a curtain in between so direct light is at a minimum, if any
Plants - java fern, java moss and a bunch of crypts, some pennywort, etc
Water changes: rather large, about 40% weekly

Water parameters:
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 0
Nitrates: always below 20ppt
pH: 8.4
KH and GH not sure, haven't tested in a while, but I have hard water
Phosphates: on the high side, I've had it spike to 2.0, for now it is a 1.0 or below. I am trying to get them under control

Dosing:
Flourish - .8-1ml at water change
Flourish Trace - mid-week, 1ml
Flourish Excel - 4ml at water change, then 1ml every other day
Flourish Potassium - 1ml twice a week

Defficiencies:
Well, for the most part the Java is fine but my crypts, although since I've started dosing the plants exploded, ONE of the nutrients above is borderline inadequate. Sometimes I'll get holes in the plants which I haven't had in a while but right now old leaves are curling up around the sides. The young ones come out nice, strong and flat but older leaves wither by curling.

I think my micronutrients are fine as the plants are constantly shootin' up a bunch of leaves, but I can't seem to manage to KEEP them healthy. What do you suggest I change or do?

In addition to all this, I have a rather bad case of black algae that looks like, well, black rust. How do I get rid of this, I've read that it's pretty resistand. Someone mentioned dosing with Maracyn?!?

Like I said, I will come back with pics.

[fishbone]

Also, since I've managed to kill every single invertebrate down to the last one by what I think was an accidental phosphate overdose which possibily raised the tank phosphates to about 3.0 [I killed 2 bamboo shrimp, about 100 MTS, ghost shrimp and other snails] part of me is contemplating trying my luck with DYI CO2 I have a 1gal system ready for use but in the past I managed to crash my pH and I panicked. Flourish Excel seems to do a good job though.

[fishbone]

Here are the 3 photos I have promised
http://picasaweb.google.com/fishbon3...09093089702274
http://picasaweb.google.com/fishbon3...09101679636882
http://picasaweb.google.com/fishbon3...09101679636898

[audzter]

hmm..did it take affect on your fish?
how many fishes died?
look.. the black algea.. if im correct its thread like and standing striaght in groups right? that means you are giving the aquarium to much lighting lessen it a bit so you can control the cycle, the plants... it seem like your plants curl when they die, just cut them off, you cant do anything and one more nice tank you have there ^^ have fun with your fishes

[fishbone]

The accidental overdose is well past me now, it's happened about 2 months ago so everything is back to normal. I lost no fish, they didn't even look stressed.

No, the black algae is not thread-like, it's just like brown algae, like rust. I read somewhere that it may be due to low nitrates and possibly low oxygen. I have increased my Flourish Excel dosing since about a month ago to daily 1ml doses, it may have something to do with it? I'll lower the dose or stop dosing altogether for a while. It's tough though, I can't easily scrape it off. I think I'll prune the affected leaves.

So you think 8 hours is still too much?

Anybody else? Any thoughts? Defficiency cause?

[jones57742]

Originally Posted by fishbone

Anybody else? Any thoughts? Defficiency cause?

fb: as you know I am not a plant guru but a few thoughts.

Do you have a "water softener"?

Think about what you did immediately before and subsequent to the algae showing up.

The problem may be an "excess cause" instead of a "deficiency cause".

Your are doing "something right" because the red pigmented plant is still exhibiting a dark red tint.

IMHO, and this is my typical knee jerk reaction, do not feed for three days and then feed for seven days at half of your typical quantity.

Decrease the lighting period by 20%. (This statement may be incorrect but I would try this first.)

Post again in five days.

TR

[fishbone]

I was also recommended that I dose with potassium, as some spotted the defficiency being related to it: holes in leaves, yellowing on the side and overall withering.
I will cut back on Flourish Excel to every other day instead of daily and also up my potassium dosing to 3 times a week as suggested on the bottle. So far I've been lax in both quantity and frequency. I am also thinking about pruning the affected leaves.

The only thing I can think of in relation to the BLACK algae showing up was me upping the Excel dose and an unforseen phosphate spike. Yes, I have a water softner but the only thing it does is changes my KH and GH from "ridiculously off the chart" to "I can live with this". My water is still hard with a pH of 8.4

[JustOneMore20]

If its brown algae, like soft brown and diatom like, it can be a result of low flow and sometimes low nitrates. That isn't always the case though and I've found it can just show up at times.

What is your nitrate reading? Are you still dosing phosphates? What is your usual phosphate reading?

Also, are all the plants looking healthy? If you have any dead or dying leaves, take them out when you see them.

I see the rust colored algae in your pics.....looks like diatom/brown algae. The other doesn't look dark green though does it (sometimes really dark colored BGA can look blackish)? That would lead to a totally different approach if it was BGA. If its hard to remove, then its not BGA. Its pretty slimey and easy to wipe off.

Honesty, I'd try to trim the affected leaves, up the potassium dosing for the holes in the leaves and keep dosing Excel. If you saw an increase in the algae with an increase in Excel, then dosing every other day is fine.

[jones57742]

Originally Posted by fishbone

Yes, I have a water softner but the only thing it does is changes my KH and GH from "ridiculously off the chart" to "I can live with this". My water is still hard with a pH of 8.4

fb:

The Readers Digest Version is that the salt which you are putting into your water softener is causing the algae problem.


fb: The long version is:

What we commonly refer to as salt is NaCl.

The salts which you are putting into your water softner are principally NaCl and KCl but very minor amounts of RbCl are also present.

TR

[fishbone]

I am at my wit's ends. Algae is still there, not a severe issue but there nonetheless. I am going to pick up a small airpump and hook up an airstone on the opposite side where the pump is to increase circulation.

Can any of you recommend a good, safe and effective algae killing chemical? I have no inverts to watch out for and I want to "start from scratch" as it were without having to trim down the affected leaves [as there is NO way to remove the black algae stuff].

API makes a product called AlgaeFix. Anyone here have any experience with it? Anything else you recommend?

[fishbone]

Well, I've done some reading and looked at some images online. Seems that the black stuff is black beard algae [BBA]. The cause is said to be low CO2. The fix is said to bump up Flourish Excel. I'll give that a shot before I go the way of chemical treatment, which I am very reluctant to do.

Also, is this really a good way to measure CO2?
Take a sample of water out of the tank and measure the pH
Let it sit 24hrs uncovered, then take another sample.
The difference in pH is going to be the equivalent of CO2 im ppm

[jones57742]

fb:

I am out of pocket and do not have my notes but you should be able to find a chart which relate Ph, Kh (or Gh) and temp to CO2 present.

TR