what epuipment do i need??

leogirl · 10-09-2006, 09:20 AM

Hello everyone

I'm going to pick up my new tank on sunday

I've been to the pet store and on line, but now i'm just confused!!!

So, i thought i'd come here here where i know i can get a REAL equipment list and not a bunch of stuff i DON'T realy need. Ok so heres the situation...
We've had our carpenter build us a tank wall to fit the tank i'm getting, but i need to know exactly what i need as far as equipment goes before he finishes the dry wall. The tank is 120gal and i plan on getting african chiclids. So what kind and size of eqipment do i need????? If anyone can make these as simple as possible for me i would realy appriciate it!

Thanks for your time!

Angie

Damon · 10-09-2006, 10:48 AM

Well I wont say this list is complete and many others will have varying opinions but a simple breakdown would be.........

Substate: Sand works. They make special substrates just for cichlids. Ordinary sand works well also

Filtration: I perfer canisters on larger tanks but a wet/dry can work as well as HOB filters. I would get 2 no matter what (1 on each end) to keep decent water flow throughout the tank.

Heaters: 120x6.5= ~800 watts of heat. 2 400watt heaters would work also one on each end.

Lighting. With no plants standard N.O. lighting will work. Not sure if a 120 is a 6 foot tank or 4 foot (believe its 6 feet).

Hardscape. Most cichlids like rockwork and caves.

Thermometer (make sure your heaters are working).

Test kit

Laura Ann · 10-09-2006, 12:17 PM

120 gallons full of African cichlids? *drools* Get some fronts... oh man those will look nice in there!!

Damon here has it pretty much on point, but I wanted to add that though it is not needed, adding a powerhead in the middle of the tank, since both filters will be on the end, will add a bit more waterflow through the middle of the tank.

Two Emperor 400 filters should do the trick... if I am not correct they have 400 gph. They are about 15 inches long and 10 inches high... As far as the other stuff i am not sure.

Lots of filteration, rockwork, and hiding places is the key to keeping African cichlids.

Good luck!!

Damon · 10-09-2006, 12:44 PM

I am not versed in cichlids but I would imagine that they are all messy eaters and messy in general. Would it not be more beneficial to use canisters since they provide more waterflow and are better for mechanical filtration?

leogirl · 10-09-2006, 04:02 PM

Cool!! Thanks guys

I'll print this out and take it up to the store with me. The dang guy at the petstore was trying to sell me just about everything on the shelves

LOL.
Oh and Laura, what are fronts?

Also, do i need the "bubble stick" things? and can i put a stingray in with the cichlids? From what i've read it sounds like they can, but i just want to make sure first. Thanks again!

Lupin · 10-09-2006, 06:44 PM

Fronts=Frontosas(Tanganyikan cichlids)

Those "bubble things" are a setup of airpump, hose and airstones. Not necessary if your tank is not overcrowded and if you're using CO2.
Stingrays should be ok with cichlids but be careful with your decisions as stingrays can grow rather large and will need wider tank floor for space.

Scuba Kid · 10-09-2006, 07:33 PM

I dont really have much to add, but Damon mentioned that he thought a 120 is 6 feet. Just want to clarify that a standard 120 is 4 feet long x 2 feet wide. I dont know the height because i dont pay much attention to tank height.
Just thought it would be useful, because the dimensions can sometimes play a role in choice of equipment.

Edit: oh and i forgot to mention.
fw stingrays will not make good tank companions with african cichlids. For one thing, they require much different water parameters and i would fear that some african cichlids (depending upon species) will pick on the gentle ray. Its eyes strike me as a sensitive picking spot.
Plus, the only stingray that would work in a 120 would be a p. reticulata with minimum rockwork and decor and a sand bottom. And many african cichlids prefer a lot of rockwork. Even then, a P. Reticulata would be cramped at full size (Disk diameter 12 inches, it's tail can add another 3/4 of that to its length).

HybridS130 · 10-09-2006, 08:34 PM

I'd like to second that that thought on freshwater stingrays as I've never really seen anyone reccomend them in a tank with any type of cichlids.

Personally I think a canister filter (or two) would be the best bang for the buck for a tank of that size. Also, a canister filter will be concealed out of sight. Two heaters would also distribute heat more evenly.

If you're just getting into aquariums and/or cichlids in general I would stay away from frontosas for the time being because they cost $40 as babies and considerably more as teenagers. There are two main types of african cichlids, Tanganyikan and Malawi, from what I understand cichlids from these two lakes should not be mixed together.

As other people have already stressed, lots and lots of rocks. Stack them up high and make several different territories instead of putting all the rocks on one side. This will give the fish more of a sense of personal space.

You can go to Lowes or any hardware store and pick up eggcrate, the stuff they use to diffuse lighting in stores. This can be cut to shape and put on the bottom glass to spread out the weight of the rocks and avoid pressure points.

Good luck with the tank and remember that all cichlids love to dig so keep that in mind when building caves.

leogirl · 10-10-2006, 11:01 AM

Ok, you guys have helped so much, THANK YOU!
The cichlids i plan on useing are the Maliwi(sp?) and the tank is 48Lx24Wx25H.
Now the only question is, what are pressure points?

Do the eggcrates go under the sand or on top of the sand?

HybridS130 · 10-10-2006, 12:38 PM

Pressure points will be caused by the rocks if you place them directly on the glass, this can cause cracks in the future. You don't want to place the rock structures on top of the sand because cichlids dig and eventually the rocks would tumble down, possibly breaking the tank. The solution is to take a completely empty tank and place either egg crate or a few thin sheets of styrofoam on the bottom glass.

Now when you place the rocks in the tank there is some padding under them and this dispurses the weight of all those rocks.

Zoe · 10-10-2006, 12:43 PM

Yeah, you can go to Home Depot and pick up some egg crate to lay on the bottom of the tank to disperse the weight of the rocks. Then you can put your substrate overtop. I suggest you place your rocks first, then your substrate, as some cichlids love to move the gravel around and could cause a rock slide.

Another thing to consider is that Sting Rays require maximum ground area, whereas the cichlids will require a lot of rockwork and other features that will use up a lot of square footage on the bottom of the tank.

(oh, it's spelled Malawi

)

Good luck!

leogirl · 10-10-2006, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoe

(oh, it's spelled Malawi

)

LOL, thanks

Well it looks like i might not be done with the questions just yet

so thanks for all the help so far and i'm sure i'll be back with more....

Scuba Kid · 10-10-2006, 03:16 PM

We'll be glad to answer any questions you have! That's why we're here!

leogirl · 10-10-2006, 08:09 PM

OK, i'm "pre"shopping on line for the equpment and i'm pretty much read to order and/or buy everything

So now to the new question...what kind of maintenance/cleaning things are needed, and do i need any of these things: water pump,protien skimmer, or water purification? Also, if anyone can recomend the best color sand to use that'd be great too

Thanks!

Scuba Kid · 10-10-2006, 09:01 PM

protein skimmers are really only necessary in saltwater set-ups, so no protein skimmer for this tank.

as for water pruification, you will need some type of tap water conditioner to get rid of chlorine and hard metals. I prefer stress-coat, but to each his own.

You should also get a test kit to test your water parameters for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and ph (these are the main levels to check). Dip strip test kits are OK for general ranges, but you will want a liquid kit for precise readings. I would suggest a liquid kit overall.
just out of curiousity, what are the paramters of your tap water? Malawians prefer fairly hard water with a high ph. If your water does not conform to this, i suggest using a substrate such as dolomite or crushed coral as a way to naturally buff your ph. I'd advise against any ph rising/lowering chemicals though. They tend to make the ph fluctuate and essentially hurt your system.

leogirl · 10-10-2006, 10:36 PM

Got it! Thanks!
I'll try and update you guys with pics as i go along, if not, i'll definatly get pics once it's ready for me fishies

judya · 10-13-2006, 06:55 PM

Neutral colored sand or gravel, tending toward darker rather than lighter.
Lots and lots of rocks, altho you can also make caves and stacks from PVC pipe or brand new clay pots - just not as good looking

Roof slates or other flat rocks in addition to round rocks make cave building easier.

A gravel vacuum - basically a flexible tube a couple of feet long, attached to a rigid tube a couple of feet long. It works by siphon, and NO, you don't have to suck on it to get the siphon started. This is for regular partial water changes, and the rigid tube goes into the gravel to pull the gunk out.

A couple of clean (new) buckets - to be used only for fish.
A notebook for observations and reminders.

Water pump. no. Although if you're moving a lot of water they can be a nice luxury. You might want a trash can on wheels to take water away, and a NEW hose to fill or do water changes.

For Malawi, be careful as the fish will hybridize if they are closely related species. Do research and try to get species that are not going to cross if you intend to breed. The females all look similar so it is hard to tell sometimes. A lot of people only want the males as they are more colorful. And unfortunately in the malawis a lot of times if you have one species, only the dominant male gets the color. The subdominant males look faded, more like the females.

joe kool · 10-15-2006, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by judya

For Malawi, be careful as the fish will hybridize if they are closely related species. Do research and try to get species that are not going to cross if you intend to breed. The females all look similar so it is hard to tell sometimes. A lot of people only want the males as they are more colorful. And unfortunately in the malawis a lot of times if you have one species, only the dominant male gets the color. The subdominant males look faded, more like the females.

I think you are generalizing "malawian" into just the peac-ocks. There is a world of Malawian's that most never see or really get into that aren't even close.

Malawian and Tangs will mix sucessfully. You do need to pay attention to size and general temperment as well as the overall "likes" of the fish. fronts actually perfer deeper cooler water than alot of people realize. Just research and find fish you like. It may end up you can't or shouldn't have a fish you really like BUT can find one very similar that will fill the bill and look almost as good for exapmle if someone loves the "fronts" but has a smaller tank or wants fish that'll stay under 7" or so try Neolamprologus tretocephalus http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/e_N...tocephalus.php

joe kool · 10-15-2006, 12:38 AM

Also I highly reccomend the Eco-Complete African Cichlid Sand. I absloutely love the stuff: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/reviews...iew.php?id=994

I did find a bag with some of the plastic strips there are some complaints about, and all the newer bags I've used have been "strip free" cloudiness is to be expected with any argonite product but it's minimized with this becouse it's shipped with water & bacteria and it keeps the cloudiness down not being dry. I'll never use crushed coral or rocks in any african tank I set up again! I like this stuff that much

I've had several tanks up for 2+ years with it and haven't had any of the "clumping" I've heard about with the "pool" or "sand box" sand some folks use, But sometimes you get what you pay for

10-09-2006, 09:20 AM	#1
leogirl Fishy Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 14	what epuipment do i need?? Hello everyone I'm going to pick up my new tank on sunday I've been to the pet store and on line, but now i'm just confused!!! So, i thought i'd come here here where i know i can get a REAL equipment list and not a bunch of stuff i DON'T realy need. Ok so heres the situation... We've had our carpenter build us a tank wall to fit the tank i'm getting, but i need to know exactly what i need as far as equipment goes before he finishes the dry wall. The tank is 120gal and i plan on getting african chiclids. So what kind and size of eqipment do i need????? If anyone can make these as simple as possible for me i would realy appriciate it! Thanks for your time! Angie

10-09-2006, 10:48 AM	#2
Damon Aquatic Naturalist Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Dayton, Ohio Age: 32 Posts: 14,972	Well I wont say this list is complete and many others will have varying opinions but a simple breakdown would be......... Substate: Sand works. They make special substrates just for cichlids. Ordinary sand works well also Filtration: I perfer canisters on larger tanks but a wet/dry can work as well as HOB filters. I would get 2 no matter what (1 on each end) to keep decent water flow throughout the tank. Heaters: 120x6.5= ~800 watts of heat. 2 400watt heaters would work also one on each end. Lighting. With no plants standard N.O. lighting will work. Not sure if a 120 is a 6 foot tank or 4 foot (believe its 6 feet). Hardscape. Most cichlids like rockwork and caves. Thermometer (make sure your heaters are working). Test kit __________________ For in much wisdom [is] much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow. Member of the AGA (Aquatic Gardner's Association) Member of the IBC (International Betta Congress)

10-09-2006, 12:17 PM	#3
Laura Ann Cichlid Addicted Join Date: May 2006 Location: Claremont, NC Age: 21 Posts: 160	120 gallons full of African cichlids? drools Get some fronts... oh man those will look nice in there!! Damon here has it pretty much on point, but I wanted to add that though it is not needed, adding a powerhead in the middle of the tank, since both filters will be on the end, will add a bit more waterflow through the middle of the tank. Two Emperor 400 filters should do the trick... if I am not correct they have 400 gph. They are about 15 inches long and 10 inches high... As far as the other stuff i am not sure. Lots of filteration, rockwork, and hiding places is the key to keeping African cichlids. Good luck!! Last edited by Laura Ann; 10-09-2006 at 12:35 PM.

10-09-2006, 12:44 PM	#4
Damon Aquatic Naturalist Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Dayton, Ohio Age: 32 Posts: 14,972	I am not versed in cichlids but I would imagine that they are all messy eaters and messy in general. Would it not be more beneficial to use canisters since they provide more waterflow and are better for mechanical filtration? __________________ For in much wisdom [is] much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow. Member of the AGA (Aquatic Gardner's Association) Member of the IBC (International Betta Congress)

10-09-2006, 07:33 PM	#7
Scuba Kid Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: RI Age: 18 Posts: 4,225	I dont really have much to add, but Damon mentioned that he thought a 120 is 6 feet. Just want to clarify that a standard 120 is 4 feet long x 2 feet wide. I dont know the height because i dont pay much attention to tank height. Just thought it would be useful, because the dimensions can sometimes play a role in choice of equipment. Edit: oh and i forgot to mention. fw stingrays will not make good tank companions with african cichlids. For one thing, they require much different water parameters and i would fear that some african cichlids (depending upon species) will pick on the gentle ray. Its eyes strike me as a sensitive picking spot. Plus, the only stingray that would work in a 120 would be a p. reticulata with minimum rockwork and decor and a sand bottom. And many african cichlids prefer a lot of rockwork. Even then, a P. Reticulata would be cramped at full size (Disk diameter 12 inches, it's tail can add another 3/4 of that to its length). __________________ Current setups: 1800 gallon koi pond, 10 gallon planted, 150 gallon reef, other FOWLR tanks Last edited by Scuba Kid; 10-09-2006 at 07:38 PM.

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10-09-2006, 04:02 PM	#5
leogirl Fishy Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 14	Cool!! Thanks guys I'll print this out and take it up to the store with me. The dang guy at the petstore was trying to sell me just about everything on the shelves LOL. Oh and Laura, what are fronts? Also, do i need the "bubble stick" things? and can i put a stingray in with the cichlids? From what i've read it sounds like they can, but i just want to make sure first. Thanks again!

10-09-2006, 06:44 PM	#6
Lupin Rock DJ Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 162	Fronts=Frontosas(Tanganyikan cichlids) Those "bubble things" are a setup of airpump, hose and airstones. Not necessary if your tank is not overcrowded and if you're using CO2. Stingrays should be ok with cichlids but be careful with your decisions as stingrays can grow rather large and will need wider tank floor for space.

10-09-2006, 08:34 PM	#8
HybridS130 ('''\_(o_O)_/''') RAWR! Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pensacola, Fla Age: 21 Posts: 161	I'd like to second that that thought on freshwater stingrays as I've never really seen anyone reccomend them in a tank with any type of cichlids. Personally I think a canister filter (or two) would be the best bang for the buck for a tank of that size. Also, a canister filter will be concealed out of sight. Two heaters would also distribute heat more evenly. If you're just getting into aquariums and/or cichlids in general I would stay away from frontosas for the time being because they cost $40 as babies and considerably more as teenagers. There are two main types of african cichlids, Tanganyikan and Malawi, from what I understand cichlids from these two lakes should not be mixed together. As other people have already stressed, lots and lots of rocks. Stack them up high and make several different territories instead of putting all the rocks on one side. This will give the fish more of a sense of personal space. You can go to Lowes or any hardware store and pick up eggcrate, the stuff they use to diffuse lighting in stores. This can be cut to shape and put on the bottom glass to spread out the weight of the rocks and avoid pressure points. Good luck with the tank and remember that all cichlids love to dig so keep that in mind when building caves. __________________

10-10-2006, 11:01 AM	#9
leogirl Fishy Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 14	Ok, you guys have helped so much, THANK YOU! The cichlids i plan on useing are the Maliwi(sp?) and the tank is 48Lx24Wx25H. Now the only question is, what are pressure points? Do the eggcrates go under the sand or on top of the sand? Last edited by leogirl; 10-10-2006 at 11:03 AM.

10-10-2006, 12:38 PM	#10
HybridS130 ('''\_(o_O)_/''') RAWR! Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pensacola, Fla Age: 21 Posts: 161	Pressure points will be caused by the rocks if you place them directly on the glass, this can cause cracks in the future. You don't want to place the rock structures on top of the sand because cichlids dig and eventually the rocks would tumble down, possibly breaking the tank. The solution is to take a completely empty tank and place either egg crate or a few thin sheets of styrofoam on the bottom glass. Now when you place the rocks in the tank there is some padding under them and this dispurses the weight of all those rocks. __________________

10-10-2006, 12:43 PM	#11
Zoe <·)))< Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Ottawa Age: 22 Posts: 1,029	Yeah, you can go to Home Depot and pick up some egg crate to lay on the bottom of the tank to disperse the weight of the rocks. Then you can put your substrate overtop. I suggest you place your rocks first, then your substrate, as some cichlids love to move the gravel around and could cause a rock slide. Another thing to consider is that Sting Rays require maximum ground area, whereas the cichlids will require a lot of rockwork and other features that will use up a lot of square footage on the bottom of the tank. (oh, it's spelled Malawi ) Good luck! __________________ 90g pltd: angelfish [black, leopard, platinum, silver zebra & gold vt] · glass catfish · harlequin rasbora · neon & rummy nosed tetra · sterpai & spotted cory · bristlenose pleco 28g pltd: scarlet badis · oto cats · bristlenose 16g pltd: flame & honey gourami · cherry barbs 8g (soon to be 18g): 15 lbs LR · 10 lbs LS · YSP · zoas · shrooms · flame & hammer corals · brittle star · scarlet & electric blue hermits · firefish

10-10-2006, 03:16 PM	#13
Scuba Kid Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: RI Age: 18 Posts: 4,225	We'll be glad to answer any questions you have! That's why we're here! __________________ Current setups: 1800 gallon koi pond, 10 gallon planted, 150 gallon reef, other FOWLR tanks

10-10-2006, 08:09 PM	#14
leogirl Fishy Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 14	OK, i'm "pre"shopping on line for the equpment and i'm pretty much read to order and/or buy everything So now to the new question...what kind of maintenance/cleaning things are needed, and do i need any of these things: water pump,protien skimmer, or water purification? Also, if anyone can recomend the best color sand to use that'd be great too Thanks!

10-10-2006, 09:01 PM	#15
Scuba Kid Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: RI Age: 18 Posts: 4,225	protein skimmers are really only necessary in saltwater set-ups, so no protein skimmer for this tank. as for water pruification, you will need some type of tap water conditioner to get rid of chlorine and hard metals. I prefer stress-coat, but to each his own. You should also get a test kit to test your water parameters for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and ph (these are the main levels to check). Dip strip test kits are OK for general ranges, but you will want a liquid kit for precise readings. I would suggest a liquid kit overall. just out of curiousity, what are the paramters of your tap water? Malawians prefer fairly hard water with a high ph. If your water does not conform to this, i suggest using a substrate such as dolomite or crushed coral as a way to naturally buff your ph. I'd advise against any ph rising/lowering chemicals though. They tend to make the ph fluctuate and essentially hurt your system. __________________ Current setups: 1800 gallon koi pond, 10 gallon planted, 150 gallon reef, other FOWLR tanks

10-10-2006, 10:36 PM	#16
leogirl Fishy Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 14	Got it! Thanks! I'll try and update you guys with pics as i go along, if not, i'll definatly get pics once it's ready for me fishies

10-13-2006, 06:55 PM	#17
judya Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Columbus, Ohio Age: 55 Posts: 223	Neutral colored sand or gravel, tending toward darker rather than lighter. Lots and lots of rocks, altho you can also make caves and stacks from PVC pipe or brand new clay pots - just not as good looking Roof slates or other flat rocks in addition to round rocks make cave building easier. A gravel vacuum - basically a flexible tube a couple of feet long, attached to a rigid tube a couple of feet long. It works by siphon, and NO, you don't have to suck on it to get the siphon started. This is for regular partial water changes, and the rigid tube goes into the gravel to pull the gunk out. A couple of clean (new) buckets - to be used only for fish. A notebook for observations and reminders. Water pump. no. Although if you're moving a lot of water they can be a nice luxury. You might want a trash can on wheels to take water away, and a NEW hose to fill or do water changes. For Malawi, be careful as the fish will hybridize if they are closely related species. Do research and try to get species that are not going to cross if you intend to breed. The females all look similar so it is hard to tell sometimes. A lot of people only want the males as they are more colorful. And unfortunately in the malawis a lot of times if you have one species, only the dominant male gets the color. The subdominant males look faded, more like the females.

10-15-2006, 12:38 AM	#19
joe kool Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Age: 36 Posts: 577	Also I highly reccomend the Eco-Complete African Cichlid Sand. I absloutely love the stuff: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/reviews...iew.php?id=994 I did find a bag with some of the plastic strips there are some complaints about, and all the newer bags I've used have been "strip free" cloudiness is to be expected with any argonite product but it's minimized with this becouse it's shipped with water & bacteria and it keeps the cloudiness down not being dry. I'll never use crushed coral or rocks in any african tank I set up again! I like this stuff that much I've had several tanks up for 2+ years with it and haven't had any of the "clumping" I've heard about with the "pool" or "sand box" sand some folks use, But sometimes you get what you pay for __________________ A conglomeration of cichlids from all over living happily in my "melting pot" of tanks. Breeding: currently nothing ... I've just been released from my one year sentence in Korea I'm back in the states!!!! Florida to be exact, so if your in the pan handle area hit me up current Fry: see above tanks: Just set up my first "fish" tank, cichlids of course 100 gal and still have the 20L planted with CRS although most of my plants didn't survive the wife's care.

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