Need advice on live plants, which fish, lighting dramas

[LauraFrog]

Hello all..
Really looking for answers here.
18.5 litre tank for Christmas. Left a few months before setting it up.
When I set it up, I filled it with wild fish and a few wild plants. Everything seemed fine until I decided I wouldn't mind a bit more colour. Worried about disease, I chose three guppies and a bristlenose. The bristlenose had the brains to hide under a rock because the wild fish which were about the same size as the guppies and quiet with each other ate all three of them. I couldn't believe it and I evicted them from the aquarium and left the poor bristlenose in there all alone. A few months later I decided to do something about the aquarium which hadn't been cared for properly as I had been very busy. It was filthy, so I disembowelled it, chucked the catfish in a jug and gave it a very thorough cleaning. I left it for about two weeks after that.
I was going to stock it all in one go but Mum set some ultimatum about room tidying and refused to let me buy more fish. I talked her into letting me buy ONE fish so the petshop didn't sell it to somebody else, a sunset wagtail platy who just happens to be pregnant *cutie*.
It's about a week later.

The night before Mum was going to let me buy more fish the light died. We don't know what's wrong but it's electrical wiring issue and completely unfixable, luckily the filter still works. So once I set up alternative lighting (which I will manage somehow) I'm buying more fish.

I know I want more platies, they are recommended for beginners on every site I have seen, but I'm not sure what else to get. Like the look of neon tetras and glowlight tetras, but I'm not sure about how easy they are to look after. I've heard something about them only breeding in hard water, but I'm not so interested in breeding - just having happy, healthy fish. I was also thinking about barbs. Any advice?

[LauraFrog]

Update: The platy gave birth today. There are at least two fry in the main tank that I can't get out. I kept eight guppies alive in a jar for almost three years (I won them at a raffle or Mum would never have given in) and there was no filtration, no aeration, just eight guppies and a live plant in a big salsa jar, but I was religious about changing the water every week. None died until the second year, and they were all full-size when I got them - I think they died of old age.
Anyway I now have at least fourteen tiny pink blobs to care for. I don't want the fry eaten, so I've managed to net twelve and set them up in that jar. Will they be OK in there?

[darkfalz]

Sigh

[JustOneMore20]

Hi Laura.....congrats on the babies!

I know you are wanting more fish, but your tank is 18.5 liters, or roughly 5 gallons for us US folks. Thats a bit small for all the fish you are wanting.

I believe that adding maybe one more platy would be ok and try to make sure its also female, so that you won't get overrun with babies. In a larger tank, it would be ok to mix males and females, but I really don't think you have the room. Neons and Glowlight tetras really need atleast 10 gallons for a school (roughly 30 liters or so), so you don't have the room for them. Barbs need the same amount of space, about 30 liters for some types, and others need more than that.

Maybe once your mom sees you are taking good care of this tank, she'll let you get something a bit bigger so you'll have more fish choices.

Do you still have the Bristlenose? If so, then definitely only add maybe one more Platy. Those 2 fish will get about 2-2.5 inches, so 2 of them are enough for a 5g, plus the Bristlenose, if you still have it.

Whenever you get a light setup, then let us know and we can recommend some plants to you. If its lower light, then Java fern, Java moss, Anacharis, and Cryptocorynes will grow fine.

[LauraFrog]

I have no intention of keeping all the platies, I'm going to ask around at school and try to give them away, there is no way that I can get all those fish in there. Believe me, I know that's ridiculous.
The people in the fish shop assured me that I would be fine with eight to ten little fish in there, and that was all I was going to stock in there anyway. Their display tanks are about twice the size of mine and many of those contain thirty small fish.

The problem with getting a bigger tank is space. To make it a bit clearer, we live in a run down little shack. We are hoping to move sometime this year or next, but we don't know where or exactly when. The tank is on a chipboard desk, or I'd have it a lot bigger than it is. It's just that the eighty litre tank I'd really like is going to weigh eighty kilos full of water. That would collapse the desk. I don't have a chance. So when we move, I was thinking I'd set the current tank up as a rearer or maybe with a few guppies/platies/tetras/other small fish, and get a big one for all the piles of fish I really want. If I could, I would clear out the pet shop, but I can't.

I think I can detect getting half flamed here for overstocking, so I'll make it clear that I wasn't going to buy all the fish I mentioned above, just some of them, and I was looking for advice on which of those species I'd be best to choose from more experienced hobbyists. There are some very attractive platies in the pet shop, and I've always liked tetras, and there are also some attractive barbs in there, I forget exactly what they were, but they're shiny and yellow and pretty. I did see one trying to bite the tail off a juvenile platy when I went in to get food for the fry though, so maybe I'd better not get those.
Thanks for the advice on the tetras. How many qualify as a 'school'? I read somewhere that they look best in schools of six or seven, but that person was talking about the visual appeal of seeing them move through the tank. Would they be happy with just two or three?

RRRR.

[Clerk]

Well the people in the shop are bonkers to of sold you a bristlenose (well a male) females are considerably smaller. I would return him and replace him with 2-3 Otocinclus Catfish.

[JustOneMore20]

I understand the space issue and that you have to work with what you've got. The pet store is just trying to sell you fish though and they'll let you overstock the tank because if some of the fish die, they know you'll come back for more.

I really think that the 2 platies (maybe one more) and the Bristlenose is enough for that size tank. Without all those fish, you could have 5-6 Neons or Glowlight tetras, but thats without the Platies and BN. I would not add a schooling fish to the tank now. Almost all Barbs get too large for your tank size.

A school is atleast 6 fish. Its not the visual aspect that determines the size, but the fish feeling comfortable. Schooling fish need a group and while different people have different starting numbers (some say 5, some say 4), its really the more the merrier and I believe that 6 is a good starting number. Visually, schools of 15-20 look really nice, but alot of tanks don't have the space for that many, so they stick with 6-8, which is more of a minimum.

I'm not flaming you at all, I just wanted you to know that if you were wanting all the fish you listed in an above post, that your tank wasn't big enough. But now I understand that you just had those as options and wasn't planning on getting them all. I am just trying to help you and that includes preventing you from overstocking the tank and having something happen to your fish.

[Scuba Kid]

Originally Posted by darkfalz

Sigh

Way to be helpful. Next time you have a problem, just don't post.

[LauraFrog]

^ That's what I meant by flaming, no offence. I mean, if you want to say something, say something that means something?

The people in the pet shop are really nice, and I've seen them refuse to sell a kitten to somebody who obviously couldn't have cared for it even when they offered to pay a hundred dollars instead of twenty. They take in all the unwanted and accidental litters from people too irresponsible to have their pets desexed and find them good homes, and sometimes keep animals almost to adulthood until somebody buys them. I know them quite well, and I don't think they are the sort of people who would deliberately mislead me for the purpose of selling more fish. If they did that would be a welfare issue anyway if they were telling people to overcrowd their tanks.
I'm just confused because I have a heap of conflicting advice. Loads of people say that tank, three or four fish, and loads more say that tank, eight or ten fish, and I don't know who to believe because there are people who I would expect to know what they were talking about on both sides.

Clerk, I live in a small town in Australia. The pet shop has exactly two species of catfish, bristlenose and corydoras, and the cories are bigger than the bn, so I wouldn't buy one of those because I'd think it would feel quite cramped in my little tank.
There are a lot of species that would suit me better than what I've got planned (i've done a bit of reading) but they just aren't available.

As far as I can tell, the bristlenose is female, almost full size and no sign of any bristles. Why shouldn't I keep her? One of my friends has two bristlenoses in a tank and she might take the fish if you honestly think that I shouldn't keep her, but she's seemed pretty happy in there.

[Clerk]

Well, I am currently breeding BN's, and I still find that my female is larger then common species of cory, and certainly produces far more waste.

Others may disagree, but I wouldn't put a BN in anything smaller then 15 gallons.

I am not trying to flame, but just because its one of the only ones there, doesn't mean you have to have it.

[LauraFrog]

I know you're not flaming me LOL. Maybe I shouldn't have said anything about flaming...

The BN I have is about as long as my little finger, and even in their 'display only - not for sale' tanks they don't have anything much bigger in the way of bristlenoses. The albino cories are bigger. They're gorgeous, but they're too big for my tnak.
How big do bristlenoses get? Mine seems comfortable in the tank. I think she's female.