I wanna do SW

[swordtailbreedr]

Hey guys. I wanna go a SW tank. I am an experianced FW guy and know nothing about SW. MY idea is

A 10g with 3 clownfish and a few shrimp and some hermit crabs

My questions are
-Is this ok
-how hard is it to maintain this amount of water
-what type of filtration
-what type of lighting
-can i get a few peices of bright colored coral
-do i need live sand
-how much will upkeep cost
-do i need a protien skimmer
-are clownfish,hermit crabs, and shrimp expensive?

Thanks for any help and sorry im such a freaking noob!

[bscman]

Let me start by saying I am NOT a s/w guy...but:

I think that's going to be a bit much for a 10g tank (by that I mean overstocked)...in fact, I don't think i'd start up a s/w tank with anything less than 30gal.

Clowns seem to be going for ~$15 each in my area, hermit crabs are cheap, and shrimp (depending on type) are fairly inexpensive.

Corals are going to require a lot of light (a regular/generic flourescent hood won't be enough).

I'd suggest you check your local shops for good books, and put your google-fu to the test...there's a TON of info out there.
I've dipped into it a little, as my fiancee REALLY wants a clown-fish (wouldn't it make a good suprise for her B-day? ) but neither of use are really ready for the commitment/cost of setting up a s/w tank.

[swordtailbreedr]

yeah that sounds like what i expected(- the fiance lol) could i do it with 2 clownfish and no coral?

[Bear]

For a beginner tank I would say not to go any smaller than a 40 gallon. When your starting its much easier to have the extra stability that comes with the extra water volume. Clownfish need at least a 30 gallon, so 3 in a 10 is a def no no.

I could go through a lot more, but at the moment I am a little tied up. If I am able to later I will, but then I'm sure the other SW guys here will be able ta help u out before that.

[swordtailbreedr]

ok thanks. i really cant afford to much so a 40g sounds a lil big for me couldnt i just do a 10g if i was dilligent? are there any small fish that are hardy and cool looking that 2-3 would work good in a 10g?

[fishbguy]

I wouldn't do a 10 gallon SW unless you know what you are doing and have experience with SW. I have a 16 that I am planning on setting up with SW. It is going to be alot of work but should be worth it in the end.

I wouldn't add any clown fish. they all get too big. if i had a 10 gallon SW I would prolly add either one pair of fire fish

http://liveaquaria.com/product/detai...cfm?pCatId=168

Or a goby of some sort. Clown gobies are really cool.

right now for my 16 gallon I am planning on1 pair of firefish and a green or citron clown goby.

you don't need live sand but I've heard it makes for good filteration. Live rock makes goof filteration as well and isn't that expensive.

that is all i can answer cause i have no experience, that is just what i learned from everybody here and from google. Just one piece of advice for you...google is you friend.

Andrew

P.S. don't forget to listen to everybody here!

[Fishboy93]

Originally Posted by swordtailbreedr

Hey guys. I wanna go a SW tank. I am an experianced FW guy and know nothing about SW. MY idea is

A 10g with 3 clownfish and a few shrimp and some hermit crabs

My questions are
-Is this ok
-how hard is it to maintain this amount of water
-what type of filtration
-what type of lighting
-can i get a few peices of bright colored coral
-do i need live sand
-how much will upkeep cost
-do i need a protien skimmer
-are clownfish,hermit crabs, and shrimp expensive?

Thanks for any help and sorry im such a freaking noob!

1- Not really. Either get a larger tank or maybe keeps some gobies.
2- At first confusing, it's not terribly difficult once you get used to it. Also if you dont keep hard corals there are less params to worry about.
3- Liverock, Protein Skimmer, Sump/Refugium.
4- It's a matter of opinion
5- Pending on lighting situation.
6- Isn't completely neccessary, I didnt.
7- Depends on how nice you want it to be...
8- You don't NEED one but I think they're pretty necessary.
9- At my LFS- Clowns: $15, Hermits(Species pending) .75-1.50, Shrimp(Skunk)-$25, (Peppermint)-$8.

HTH

[Ice]

For a beginner as yourself - start with a 46 gallon. You just might make do with a 38G tank but with only a single pair of clownfish. Definitely DO NOT start with a 10G tank !! Can be done but very hard to maintain for a beginner.

But first thing you need to do is read and research everything about saltwater keeping. Read "The Conscientious Marine Aquarist" by Bob Fenner. There are other good SW books to read as well. Read all first and take it slow.

[Damon]

Not to beat a dead horse but since it was brought up might as well.........

10 gallon is a no no for your FIRST sw tank.
Setup is expensive. Expect to pay at least 500 to start for even a small 30 gallon setup.

Protein skimmers are a big bonus, especially for your first setup. Expect to pay ~ $100.00 for a quality one.

Live rock will run over $150.00 for a 30 gallon.

Lighting at least another $100.00

Sumps are a boon and make life much easier. Get one within a year of your setup.

A new tank takes time for break-in. Dont expect to add critters and fish for at least 3 months.

Get a Ro/Di unit. Will save you money and headaches. (Another $100.00)

SW is not something to jump in but takes a lot of planning to increase your chances of success.

[swordtailbreedr]

i think ts to overwhelming i changed my mind.

[Osiris]

a 20g long would suffice as well, if really wanted to. Twin tube lighting at 20w/each would suffice for low lighting coral like green star burst polyps

[Osiris]

But gotta think:
Light -$30 (one 10k and one atnic)
Tank -$30
Filteration-$33(id go with aquaclear conversion to refugium)
Heater-$20
Liverock-$50
Sand-$20
Fish-$40(two clowns at decent price!)

Just kinda a break down..

[CollegeReefer]

To give you an idea of cost so you can keep some softies and polyps, my 20 gallon nano tank cost me about a 1000 dollars to set up which included a clean up crew. That cost does not cover fish or coral. To set up our 75 gallon tank it only costed us about 1300 dollars. Small tanks don't equal cheaper. One might think this but in the end, the cost per gallon is much more in a smaller tank then a larger tank.

[Osiris]

Damn! quit buyin stuff at LFS lol

[Reefneck]

Originally Posted by Osiris

Damn! quit buyin stuff at LFS lol

That is not a good idea! What happens to us little guys at the LFS when everyone buys online? We go away. What happens when you buy an $800 light fixture online that goes out after a month and you have your tank stocked with some expensive corals? They tell you to ship it back to them and when it is received they will send you a replacement. What happens to your Corals during that 2-3 weeks? Buy the same light at the LFS, Light quits in 30 days.....Take the light to LFS, We check it, Possibly repair it or replace it on the spot. You go home happy and your corals are happy.

Same thing applies with filtration. If your filter breaks can your tank survive 2-3 weeks while you ship it back for repair or replacement?

How about heaters, or chillers. Depending on how bad you tank needs these items you may be in deep poo having to ship them back to online dealers!

And sure, You can buy fish online too. But how often does the fish actually look like the picture you saw? Isn't it better to see the actual fish you are buying in person than to trust a camera and/or lighting? Same with corals! Shipping also causes stress on both types of animals! What a hassle when your $150 fish died and now you have to send it back just to get a credit or maybe a replacement that may or may not make it through shipping to you. A life or lives lost because we are too cheap to pay a little more for an animal.

I try to match prices on my livestock as best I can. Right now I have a Mcollochi Pseudochromis in the store. It sells for $149.99 here: http://www.marinecenter.com/fish/pse...pseudochromis/

My price? $154.99. So, Why order it online? To save $5? Or is it just plain laziness and you want it brought to your door? Or maybe it's because the LFS is 20 miles away and gas is $3.00 a gallon??

All excuses! If the closest LFS is 100 miles away, OK. I understand but any closer than that and it's just causing that LFS that will be there for you in an emergency to go out of business. And don't forget when your return pump that you bought online quits you better have a back up because you can't bring it to me for a replacement!

EDIT: This is not directed at anyone in particular but is a general statement!

[GoodMike]

Reef, the thing is, people will buy the stuff online, and still take it to the LFS to try and fix it. They dont care, people never think about the rent and over head that the lfs has, they just all assume that the LFS is price gouging. Where i work, if people keep coming in for advice, by the 3rd time if they arent spending money, they get the "my advice isnt free" speech. I totally agree with you that money needs to be spent at the local stores if you expect them to stay open. Support your local stores, cause you are supporting local hobbyists

[Reefneck]

I had a customer buy a Coralife Super Skimmer 65 from me. He brought it back 2 days later and said it won't fit on his tank with his hood. It was still all wrapped, Only the outer box was opened. He said he just sat the skimmer body on the tank and saw it would not fit. I gave him a store credit for the amount of the skimmer. (We don't do cash refunds).

One week later the same customer called me. He said he boaught a skimmer online and didn't know how to put it together. I ask him what skimmer. It was the same one he returned to me. Now all of a sudden, It fit's his tank! I told him how to put it together being nice. He calls back an hour later saying that he still can't figure it out! At this point, I told him that I will come out and hook it up for him at a charge of $35.00 for a service call. I never heard from him again!

I will not support products you people buy online! How does that pay my rent?
If you buy it online then call the online dealer you bought it from when you need help! Or buy it from me and get instant help for free whenever you need it (During business hours).

[Ice]

I'm going to have to agree with Reefneck and Mike regarding buying products online. I went to a lfs to inquire on the best price he can give me on a 46G BF w/stand w/ overflows. He told me and him & I got to talking about how I wanted to set up a SW tank in a couple years and whatnot. The store owner told me he would take care of me and help me set up the tank along with a sump, etc ... I've stopped in his store quite abit with my 3 yr old (cuz he wants to see the fishies - LOL !!) and bought some stuff there; I know he won't steer me wrong. Definitely support your LFS by getting a good clientelle with the owner. You'd be surprised if some might give you a discount or a better deal.

[Damon]

It works both ways. I agree with both of you. A GOOD lfs can be a lifesaver. Taking the time to establish a repoire with them can guide you well. I buy on-line all the time. But usually after consulting with my local guru. He helped me set up my tank. And even REFUSED to sell me stuff in the beginning. Saved me a lot of time and money listening to him as I didnt buy animals doomed to die. He gives me great deals when he can and even tells me reputable on-line places to buy from and the ups and down of them. I wouldn't be where I am with my tank without Joel.

[CollegeReefer]

I am all about supporting local fish stores, but the one in point prices are very high. Sometimes double of what i can get it it a different fish store or online. I won't pay 40 bucks for a maxijet 1200. Getting things used though is the way to go though.