betta tankmates

vettech909 · 03-10-2008, 08:08 PM

i have a huge male crowntail betta named oswald.his tank is next to a female goldfish named sithigar.i have a bigger tank and i was wondering if they would get along.could they live together without getting nipped fins?please help!!!

trashion · 03-10-2008, 08:10 PM

No. Bettas are tropical and need heated water around 78 degrees, goldfish are coldwater and do better at room temperature.

Clerk · 03-10-2008, 09:07 PM

Make sure sithigar has a tank of at least 20 gallons.

CarterNichols · 03-10-2008, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trashion

No. Bettas are tropical and need heated water around 78 degrees, goldfish are coldwater and do better at room temperature.

i have never seen a betta with a heater, my girlfriend has one that has lived in a bowl for a year.. besides they are usually just in cups anywhere you get them.

shade2dope · 03-10-2008, 09:23 PM

Yes they will live without heat but is it the right way....no.just cause somthing can live without something doesnt make it happy.

CarterNichols · 03-10-2008, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shade2dope

Yes they will live without heat but is it the right way....no.just cause somthing can live without something doesnt make it happy.

well, he swims around, is responsive to my girlfriend, eats without problems and has grown and developed quite nicely, if you have some other way of decoding a fishes feelings please share.

trashion · 03-10-2008, 10:08 PM

Right, well, my grandmother had a betta that lived FIVE years in a bowl with no heat. Did it live a long time? Yes. My grandmother's house is very stable in temp, and she keeps the temperature high. But cases like this are the exception, not the rule.

You can keep a dog in a 4 ft x 4 ft pen in the yard with a shoddy shelter, but no one wants to subject that animal to conditions that are far from optimal. Why keep a fish in conditions that are far from optimal?

CarterNichols · 03-10-2008, 10:23 PM

okay but my point is the fish shows no signs of stress or being uncomfortable, it has been doing as fine as a betta with heat would be..

Obsidian · 03-10-2008, 10:34 PM

A mind is like a parachute: It only works when it is open.

CarterNichols · 03-10-2008, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obsidian

A mind is like a parachute: It only works when it is open.

even though i know this was directed toward me, maybe people should take into consideration just because the companies that make and sell the heaters tell you, you need one for a fish to be "happy" doesn't mean its set in stone or true for that matter..

my girlfriends betta shows all signs of a fully healthy and content fish and has for a year.. i think it'll be okay if i don't get a heater for it.

trashion · 03-10-2008, 10:56 PM

I beg your pardon? No company ever told me I needed a heater to make my fish happy. I did it because I'm not a jerk and I research what my fish need to be happiest and healthiest.

CarterNichols · 03-10-2008, 11:16 PM

where do you think this research comes from, places that breed bettas, who in turn supply petstores nation wide, who are bound by contracts with companies that manufacture products such as heaters.. these stores and the companies have to sell X amount of heaters to be profitable so they push research done by there "experts" that say oh this fish will not be happy unless you have this..

from common knowledge a "happy" fish is one that is healthy, active, personable.. all of which the betta in question is, without a heater...

i don't know how you figure someone is a jerk for not buying a heater for a fish that can obviously thrive without one... there are no heaters in the ocean, and if you think the temperature stays at 78 degrees then i'm sorry...

bettas that are in stores and or the majority of homes are kept without heaters.. its not like i'm keeping it in the fridge and it has a sad face and holding up a sign calling me a jerk.. her room temperature is like 76 anyways... so please don't call PETA on me for not going out and buying a heater for the betta..

shade2dope · 03-10-2008, 11:17 PM

ok you are taking a fish from it's natural habitat and its your responsibility to duplicate that.I breed bettas and I can tell you that temp have a big roll in there growing.I bet you got that betta from the petstore np but most of those are 1 year + after that there pretty much done.I bet you were just saying that(without problems and has grown and developed quite nicely).I leaveing this thread alone and trashion I recommend the same to you before we get banned.

Back to the thread and sorry for hijacking it.Snails or African dwarf frogs I have heard work good with eack other.The problem is why we buy them there attractive fins.Other fish see this slow moving fish and go for it.Good tank mates should be non-aggressive and non-territorial.

CarterNichols · 03-10-2008, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shade2dope

ok you are taking a fish from it's natural habitat and its your responsibility to duplicate that.I breed bettas and I can tell you that temp have a big roll in there growing.I bet you got that betta from the petstore np but most of those are 1 year + after that there pretty much done.I bet you were just saying that(without problems and has grown and developed quite nicely).I leaveing this thread alone and trashion I recommend the same to you before we get banned.

really, there are heaters in bettas natural enviroment?

read my comments before you go making assumptions.. i clearly stated the room temperature where the betta is located is 76 degrees subsequently that is the temperature of the water..
going back to you not reading, trashion clearly stated that her grandmother had a betta ( i assume from the petstore, because that is where you buy most fish

) lived for 5+ years, and oh my god it did not have a heater.

and just like you can bet i "just said that" i can bet you don't have a clue what you are talking about.

my apologies to the OP, you can have your thread back now.

Buggy · 03-11-2008, 08:27 AM

Ok, so your girlfriend has kept 1 betta in 1 bowl for 1 year at 76F and it has done fine. Great! But not everyone keeps their house at a constant comfy tropical temp therefor you need a heater to keep the TANK WATER at that constant optimal temp. What do you think would happen to that fish if the room temp suddenly dropped to say 50F?
The information these people are giving doesn't come from just one or two personal experiences. It comes from reading and researching hundreds of resources written by hundreds of professional fish keepers and breeders over several decades. The scientists and marine biologists that observe and record this information aren't supporting the sales of aquarium heaters. They are bringing to the public awareness the natural conditions in which these creatures live and thrive so that those conditions can be duplicated in a controlled environment.
The same thing goes for that goldfish. It can withstand temp fluctuations of several degrees but it would take only one time of the temp jumping up to 90F to cause serious problems or even death. The heater is not just to MAKE the water the proper temp but to KEEP it there. Even animals kept in zoos must be kept in controlled conditions that mimic their natural habitat for them to survive and thrive.
In short, a kangaroo might be able to visit a polar bear in Alaska for a while but he can't live there.

trashion · 03-11-2008, 09:27 AM

Well said, Buggy.

shade2dope · 03-11-2008, 09:33 AM

I am not saying there are heater's in wild. The heater is there to mimic the natural temp.There are exceptions.I dont heat every liltle jar that my fry are in but I do have a reliable space heater in the room that keeps temps around 78.I also have the room sealed so there are no drafts.But in general people dont do this so saying bettas dont need a heater is not right.I now at my gf's house if your not there to stock the wood stove temp can drop to low 60's.

CarterNichols · 03-11-2008, 10:29 AM

buggy, in a bettas natural environment at night the water does drop to 50..

oh and kangaroos are warm blooded meaning they would be able to adapt to cold temperature even though alaska has a very mild climate and there isn't a steady population of polar bears there.. and in an Australian desert at night the temperature can drop to near or below freezing, you really really need to learn what you are talking about before saying anything.

like it's okay for you to gang up, call me a liar, and convince your self that you are right, but the simple fact is you aren't and the fish can do fine and live a natural life without a heater. and please don't tell me the fish isn't "happy" because according to your "expert" research that has been done by hundreds of decades says that my fish is a happy fish

trashion · 03-11-2008, 11:18 AM

These aren't wild-caught fish, their "natural environment" really isn't relevant any more. They have been captive-bred for generations in heavily controlled climates.

vettech909 · 03-11-2008, 12:16 PM

since i cant put sithigar with oswald,can i put the goldfish with a very peaceful,fat pacu?his name is mona and wont eat a small feeder goldfish and wont even bother his old tankmates.sithigar is WAY to big to fit in monas mouth.if that doesnt work out,can i put the goldfish in a tank with a common pleco and a little pacu?i know this is stupid and probly cant be done but can i put the goldfish with my jack dempseys?the tanks are undercrowded and can use a little more fish.wich would be the best?

03-10-2008, 08:08 PM	#1
vettech909 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Age: 18 Posts: 146 User Feedback: (0)	betta tankmates i have a huge male crowntail betta named oswald.his tank is next to a female goldfish named sithigar.i have a bigger tank and i was wondering if they would get along.could they live together without getting nipped fins?please help!!! __________________ 55GALLON: 1 PACU 1 GOLDFISH 2 GOLD GOURAMIS 1 RED EARED SLIDER TURTLE 1 YELLOW BELLIED SLIDER TURTLE 5GALLON: 3 ALBINO BLACK SKIRT TETRAS 1 "MUPPY" 2 PLATYS 1 BLACK KUHLI LOACH 2.5GALLON: 1 ALBINO MBUNA CICHLID BETTA BOWL: 1 RED MALE BETTA DREAM TANK: PLANTED W//BLACK GRAVEL 3 ZEBRA DANIOS 6 PIGMY CORY CATS 4 TIGER BARBS 2 BLACK TETRAS 4 MARBLE HATCHET FISH 10 GALLON: 1 FEMALE EASTERN BOX TURTLE(GETTING A 50GALLON PLASTIC TUB SOON)

03-10-2008, 08:10 PM	#2
trashion girl anachronism Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 932 User Feedback: (0)	No. Bettas are tropical and need heated water around 78 degrees, goldfish are coldwater and do better at room temperature. __________________ current setup: 15 gallon, planted w/ pressurized co2, 55watts PC lighting, EI fert dosing. -5 harlequin rasboras -7 Aspidoras pauciradiatus (sixray or false corydoras) for reference: my name is Julie

03-10-2008, 09:07 PM	#3
Clerk Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Oregon Posts: 459 User Feedback: (0)	Make sure sithigar has a tank of at least 20 gallons. __________________ Four Tanks 55 Gallon - Planted Display Tank 50 Gallon Nursery 20 Gallon - High-Light Planted Breeder 20 L Gallon - Newt Paludarium

03-10-2008, 09:23 PM	#5
shade2dope Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Age: 19 Posts: 370 User Feedback: (0)	Yes they will live without heat but is it the right way....no.just cause somthing can live without something doesnt make it happy. __________________ 3 Aulonocara Sp Maleri 2 female Two eletric blu ali 1 male 1 female,Clown Pleco,abn,Yellow Lab Two Haplochromis ruby green and some juvies, two flame backs one female, compressicep,Fancy Guppies Goby Dragon,Jack Demsey,Altolamprologus calvus (Chaitika)

03-10-2008, 10:08 PM	#7
trashion girl anachronism Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 932 User Feedback: (0)	Right, well, my grandmother had a betta that lived FIVE years in a bowl with no heat. Did it live a long time? Yes. My grandmother's house is very stable in temp, and she keeps the temperature high. But cases like this are the exception, not the rule. You can keep a dog in a 4 ft x 4 ft pen in the yard with a shoddy shelter, but no one wants to subject that animal to conditions that are far from optimal. Why keep a fish in conditions that are far from optimal? __________________ current setup: 15 gallon, planted w/ pressurized co2, 55watts PC lighting, EI fert dosing. -5 harlequin rasboras -7 Aspidoras pauciradiatus (sixray or false corydoras) for reference: my name is Julie

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03-10-2008, 10:23 PM	#8
CarterNichols Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Age: 18 Posts: 109 User Feedback: (0)	okay but my point is the fish shows no signs of stress or being uncomfortable, it has been doing as fine as a betta with heat would be.. __________________ Freshwater. 4 SunBurst Platties.2 Neon Tetras.2 ghost shrimp.2 snails Saltwater. 2 Ocellaris Clown Fish.Coral Banded Shrimp.2 hermits.

03-10-2008, 10:34 PM	#9
Obsidian Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Arizona Age: 37 Posts: 911 User Feedback: (0)	A mind is like a parachute: It only works when it is open. __________________ Obsidian 20 gallon 1 Dwarf Gourami; 6 Cherry Barbs 4F 2M; 8 Black Neon Tetras; 3 Peppered Cory's; 1 Bristlenose Pleco 10 gallon 5 Zebra Danios 5.5 gallon Betta 100 gallon 9 giant danios; 4 Rosy Barbs, 4 German Blue Rams

03-10-2008, 10:56 PM	#11
trashion girl anachronism Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 932 User Feedback: (0)	I beg your pardon? No company ever told me I needed a heater to make my fish happy. I did it because I'm not a jerk and I research what my fish need to be happiest and healthiest. __________________ current setup: 15 gallon, planted w/ pressurized co2, 55watts PC lighting, EI fert dosing. -5 harlequin rasboras -7 Aspidoras pauciradiatus (sixray or false corydoras) for reference: my name is Julie

03-10-2008, 11:16 PM	#12
CarterNichols Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Age: 18 Posts: 109 User Feedback: (0)	where do you think this research comes from, places that breed bettas, who in turn supply petstores nation wide, who are bound by contracts with companies that manufacture products such as heaters.. these stores and the companies have to sell X amount of heaters to be profitable so they push research done by there "experts" that say oh this fish will not be happy unless you have this.. from common knowledge a "happy" fish is one that is healthy, active, personable.. all of which the betta in question is, without a heater... i don't know how you figure someone is a jerk for not buying a heater for a fish that can obviously thrive without one... there are no heaters in the ocean, and if you think the temperature stays at 78 degrees then i'm sorry... bettas that are in stores and or the majority of homes are kept without heaters.. its not like i'm keeping it in the fridge and it has a sad face and holding up a sign calling me a jerk.. her room temperature is like 76 anyways... so please don't call PETA on me for not going out and buying a heater for the betta.. __________________ Freshwater. 4 SunBurst Platties.2 Neon Tetras.2 ghost shrimp.2 snails Saltwater. 2 Ocellaris Clown Fish.Coral Banded Shrimp.2 hermits. Last edited by CarterNichols; 03-10-2008 at 11:35 PM.

03-10-2008, 11:17 PM	#13
shade2dope Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Age: 19 Posts: 370 User Feedback: (0)	ok you are taking a fish from it's natural habitat and its your responsibility to duplicate that.I breed bettas and I can tell you that temp have a big roll in there growing.I bet you got that betta from the petstore np but most of those are 1 year + after that there pretty much done.I bet you were just saying that(without problems and has grown and developed quite nicely).I leaveing this thread alone and trashion I recommend the same to you before we get banned. Back to the thread and sorry for hijacking it.Snails or African dwarf frogs I have heard work good with eack other.The problem is why we buy them there attractive fins.Other fish see this slow moving fish and go for it.Good tank mates should be non-aggressive and non-territorial. __________________ 3 Aulonocara Sp Maleri 2 female Two eletric blu ali 1 male 1 female,Clown Pleco,abn,Yellow Lab Two Haplochromis ruby green and some juvies, two flame backs one female, compressicep,Fancy Guppies Goby Dragon,Jack Demsey,Altolamprologus calvus (Chaitika)

03-11-2008, 08:27 AM	#15
Buggy Room Mother Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Oklahoma Age: 42 Posts: 659 User Feedback: (0)	Ok, so your girlfriend has kept 1 betta in 1 bowl for 1 year at 76F and it has done fine. Great! But not everyone keeps their house at a constant comfy tropical temp therefor you need a heater to keep the TANK WATER at that constant optimal temp. What do you think would happen to that fish if the room temp suddenly dropped to say 50F? The information these people are giving doesn't come from just one or two personal experiences. It comes from reading and researching hundreds of resources written by hundreds of professional fish keepers and breeders over several decades. The scientists and marine biologists that observe and record this information aren't supporting the sales of aquarium heaters. They are bringing to the public awareness the natural conditions in which these creatures live and thrive so that those conditions can be duplicated in a controlled environment. The same thing goes for that goldfish. It can withstand temp fluctuations of several degrees but it would take only one time of the temp jumping up to 90F to cause serious problems or even death. The heater is not just to MAKE the water the proper temp but to KEEP it there. Even animals kept in zoos must be kept in controlled conditions that mimic their natural habitat for them to survive and thrive. In short, a kangaroo might be able to visit a polar bear in Alaska for a while but he can't live there. __________________ Fish are people too! My animal family Dixie - Boxer/Lab Peanut -Chihuahua Cali - American Short-hair Cat B.B. - Parakeet Flower - Western Ornate Box Turtle Aquariums 55 gal tropical Fresh Water -14 various fish 29 gal tropical Fresh Water - 4 various cichlids 20 gal tropical Fresh Water - 5 skirt tetras, 8 zebra danios, 2 cherry barbs, 1 glass catfish, 1 rosey minnow, 1 corydora, 1 ghost shrimp. 3 empty 10 gal tanks

03-11-2008, 09:27 AM	#16
trashion girl anachronism Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 932 User Feedback: (0)	Well said, Buggy. __________________ current setup: 15 gallon, planted w/ pressurized co2, 55watts PC lighting, EI fert dosing. -5 harlequin rasboras -7 Aspidoras pauciradiatus (sixray or false corydoras) for reference: my name is Julie

03-11-2008, 09:33 AM	#17
shade2dope Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Age: 19 Posts: 370 User Feedback: (0)	I am not saying there are heater's in wild. The heater is there to mimic the natural temp.There are exceptions.I dont heat every liltle jar that my fry are in but I do have a reliable space heater in the room that keeps temps around 78.I also have the room sealed so there are no drafts.But in general people dont do this so saying bettas dont need a heater is not right.I now at my gf's house if your not there to stock the wood stove temp can drop to low 60's. __________________ 3 Aulonocara Sp Maleri 2 female Two eletric blu ali 1 male 1 female,Clown Pleco,abn,Yellow Lab Two Haplochromis ruby green and some juvies, two flame backs one female, compressicep,Fancy Guppies Goby Dragon,Jack Demsey,Altolamprologus calvus (Chaitika)

03-11-2008, 10:29 AM	#18
CarterNichols Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Age: 18 Posts: 109 User Feedback: (0)	buggy, in a bettas natural environment at night the water does drop to 50.. oh and kangaroos are warm blooded meaning they would be able to adapt to cold temperature even though alaska has a very mild climate and there isn't a steady population of polar bears there.. and in an Australian desert at night the temperature can drop to near or below freezing, you really really need to learn what you are talking about before saying anything. like it's okay for you to gang up, call me a liar, and convince your self that you are right, but the simple fact is you aren't and the fish can do fine and live a natural life without a heater. and please don't tell me the fish isn't "happy" because according to your "expert" research that has been done by hundreds of decades says that my fish is a happy fish __________________ Freshwater. 4 SunBurst Platties.2 Neon Tetras.2 ghost shrimp.2 snails Saltwater. 2 Ocellaris Clown Fish.Coral Banded Shrimp.2 hermits. Last edited by CarterNichols; 03-11-2008 at 10:42 AM.

03-11-2008, 11:18 AM	#19
trashion girl anachronism Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 932 User Feedback: (0)	These aren't wild-caught fish, their "natural environment" really isn't relevant any more. They have been captive-bred for generations in heavily controlled climates. __________________ current setup: 15 gallon, planted w/ pressurized co2, 55watts PC lighting, EI fert dosing. -5 harlequin rasboras -7 Aspidoras pauciradiatus (sixray or false corydoras) for reference: my name is Julie

03-11-2008, 12:16 PM	#20
vettech909 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Age: 18 Posts: 146 User Feedback: (0)	since i cant put sithigar with oswald,can i put the goldfish with a very peaceful,fat pacu?his name is mona and wont eat a small feeder goldfish and wont even bother his old tankmates.sithigar is WAY to big to fit in monas mouth.if that doesnt work out,can i put the goldfish in a tank with a common pleco and a little pacu?i know this is stupid and probly cant be done but can i put the goldfish with my jack dempseys?the tanks are undercrowded and can use a little more fish.wich would be the best? __________________ 55GALLON: 1 PACU 1 GOLDFISH 2 GOLD GOURAMIS 1 RED EARED SLIDER TURTLE 1 YELLOW BELLIED SLIDER TURTLE 5GALLON: 3 ALBINO BLACK SKIRT TETRAS 1 "MUPPY" 2 PLATYS 1 BLACK KUHLI LOACH 2.5GALLON: 1 ALBINO MBUNA CICHLID BETTA BOWL: 1 RED MALE BETTA DREAM TANK: PLANTED W//BLACK GRAVEL 3 ZEBRA DANIOS 6 PIGMY CORY CATS 4 TIGER BARBS 2 BLACK TETRAS 4 MARBLE HATCHET FISH 10 GALLON: 1 FEMALE EASTERN BOX TURTLE(GETTING A 50GALLON PLASTIC TUB SOON)

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