Which Ones?

[fishbguy]

As many of you may know, I have a 40 tall that I am in the process of setting up. Thus far, I've been thinking about african cichlids, which have been knocked out, and an amazonion bio-tope, angels, tetras, and cories. But the other day in english, we were working with sentances and writing about convicts. Not the fish, people in jail...lol So naturally, all I could think about were the fish and my tank etc. So I got to thinking about what other "medium sized" cichlids I could put in it. I was thinking about convicts, but everybody has them and they aren't that hard to spawn So the only other medium sized cichlid I cn think of would be fire mouths. So I was wondering if y'all could give me some ideas of other medium sized cichlids for a 40 tall. But a few rules, no angels, rams, apistos, or other dwarf cichlids. No africans or chromides either.

[emc7]

Blue Acara (IMO too big for true dwarf) or gymnogeophagus?

[Dr_House]

Convicts are fairly easy to sex, so if you're interested in them but don't want them breeding, you could always get females. I didn't pay much attention in biology, but I'm pretty sure that would take care of the breeding issue.

There is also the Port cichlid (Cichlasoma portalegrense). While not actually a cichlid, the Snakeskin Gourami (Trichogaster pectoralis) attains a decent size and many people find it an attractive fish.

You may also want to check out [url]www.tangledupincichlids.com[/ul]. Many people order from this site and it is a good place to find cichlids that are not commonly seen in pet stores. Good luck with the stocking.

[fishbguy]

I kinda want baby fishies...lol so no cons.

I was thinking about fire mouths. what are good tnak mates?

keyhole cichlids? the lfs i work at has a few of these, about 2-3 inches long.

how big to salvanis get?

[redpaulhus]

laetacaras - the 'smiling' acaras -- would work if your water runs a pH of 7 or lower - Laetacara curviceps shouldn't be too hard to find and are very attractive. They are on the edge of dwarf/not dwarf cichlidness - but in a 40g, not too many non-dwarfs will do well.

My Blue Acara's are IMO too big for a 40 -- I've got mine in a 125g and it looks about right size wise for them, they really like to have some space (but then again I like all cichlids bigger than about 4" in a 125g ) -- smallest I would do would be a 55g tank for Blue Acara's.
Likewise (IMO) firemouths, salvini's, etc.

Another good choice if your water runs around 7.2 or below would be 'kribs' or any of the 'krib' cousins - Pelvicachromis taeniatus etc. I've got P. taeniatus 'moliwe' ('moliwe' is the location this strain is from) and I love them - very active, very colorful, hardy, and pretty easy to breed, and reasonably sized for a 40g tank.
http://www.gsas.org/Articles/1997/P-t-moliwe.html


Also - there are a number of "convicts" other than the common "convict" that would do great in a 40g if your water pH runs above 7.
I've got the "yellow convict" at home - Cryptoheros nanoluteus - they are very cool.
http://www.aquariumlife.net/profiles...ict/100140.asp
Another good choice would be the "Honduran Redpoint" - a currently undescripted Cryptoheros species - or the "sajica" - Cryptoheros sajica.
All of these are "convict-ish" -- they like fairly hard water with a stable pH, etc.
Eventually they will probably end up as domesticated as the common convict (ie will live in a bucket of spit, and breed if the spit is changed somewhat regularly) but right now I would pay more attention to keeping the water parameters close to the wild than is needed with common convicts.

The thing to realize is, even these 4-5" fish would be considered "dwarf" to some people. On the other hand, most Apisto breeders would consider these "big" cichlids

Last thought - dwarf pike cichlids.
Yes, they are "dwarfs" -- but "dwarf Pike" is kinda like "jumbo shrimp" -- how dwarf can a pike be ?
I've kept Crenicichla regani - very cool fish. Big pike attitude in a small package, definately managable in a 40g tank (I was keeping mine in a densely planted 29g).
http://www.geocities.com/NapaValley/...dwarfpike.html

[fishbguy]

I completely forgot about dwarf pikes...they would be some of the only dwarfsI would consider. The largest fish I've ever owned, is about 2 inches, so anything about 4 inches or larger is a big fish to me...lol

My water's Ph runs at about 7.5-8, so I have relativaly hard water, even tho it goes through a water softner...well water..lol

[fishbguy]

Those Dwarf pikes deffaintaly interest me. But most of the sites say that it is best to use some kind of dither fish, what would you suggest for dither fish? are they easy to breed? whats the best way, a cave, slate, etc.?

[fishbguy]

I've decided between the dwarf pikes and firemouths, I'll prolly end up going with firemouths, because they will be cheaper as far as tank set up, and they are easier to find.

I still need to know what good tankmates for firemouths would be. I was thinking about a munch of mollies, and some serpae tetras, or a school of tiger barbs. I'm leaning more towards the serpae tetras and the mollies. what do y'all think?

[JustOneMore20]

I can't help ya on the tankmates, but just wanted to remind folks that the dimensions of the tank are like a tall 29g.....so length is limited.

If Firemouths will work, I suggest them over Convicts. Convicts breed like rabbits and while you may want them, eventually you'll be overrun with them and usually LFS won't take the babies.

Serpae tetras may work as dithers.

[Gourami Swami]

Originally Posted by JustOneMore20

eventually you'll be overrun with them

I would have to disagree. After about 3-4 weeks, most convict parents eat the remainder of the babies so they can spawn again. I bred convicts for about a year and was never overrun. Then again i have lots of other cichlids to feed em to, but i dont think being overrun would be a problem.

Ant BTW, dont get so set on firemouths yet, there are lots of other mid sizwede cichlids that would work well and are IME more interesting. A few would be

Archocentrus Centrarchus http://www.cichlidae.com/wallpapers/w033.jpg

Rainbow cichlids (Multispinosa) http://www.aquamojo.com/misc/Herotil...ltispinosa.JPG

T-bar cichlids (Sajicas) http://www.worldcichlids.com/fotm/im...jeff_rapps.jpg

or Neetroplus Nematopus (Neets) http://www.tangledupincichlids.com/images/neet.fem.jpg

All these are relatively easy to find if you have a well stocked fish store, and the only aggressive ones really are the neets. Good luck man, if you want any info on any of these guys send me a PM

[fishbguy]

I thought I said it was a 40 tall, oh well...

I really like the Sajicas and the Centrarchus Nelson....the multis and the neets, not so much.

If possible, I'll look into getting a pair of them, but money is also an issue, but firemouths are still my secpnd choice after those.

[emc7]

Both serpaes and tiger barbs are mean nippy schooling fish. It would be fun to watch them get chewed on by cichlids, but the size school you need to keep them from killing each other might be pushing the tank's capacity. Rainbow, butterfly & and red-tail goodieds are mostly top-dwellers that like hard water. They hold there own with mbuna without getting nippy, so I'm guessing they would do well with Central American cichlids, too.