South Americans in 38G

[Cliffizme2]

What kind of South Americans can I put in a 38gallon and how many? I don't want anything that will eat up my live plants and they have to get along with my 2 little pleco's.
I have ruled out Africans because I've heard they will destroy my plants. I kinda like the regular black Oscars but I'm not sure what all I can put in a tank this size? My understanding is that they get pretty big.

[Mobydock]

Oscars are a denfinate no, your tank would have to be atleast double the size for one. If those are just common plecos, you've already got a problem right there. Common plecos get quite large and if I am correct, you need a very large tank if you wish to house more than one.

The number of cichlids is really up to you, depending on the species you choose. I beleive a pair of Angels would live nicely in that size tank, without destroying your plants(and they come in black). There are also apistos and rams, which stay smaller, so more could be kept in that size tank.

[SpongeBob]

Just to add to what Mobydock has already said, I have a 35 gal with an Oscar and a Jack Dempsey in it. Initially, they were in my 55gal tank along with 2 other cichlids ( a green severum and a jewel ). I purchased them all at the end of November. In Dec. we decided to convert the 55gal to salt and transfer the cichlids into the 35gal. At that time, my Oscar, which was about an inch and a half long at the time of purchase, was already 2" long. Now, one month later, he is over 5" LONG!!!

Needless to say that we will have to return him to our LFS and get a smaller one... and return it in 3 or 4 months and so on. Until my LFS tells me to stop because he can not sell them... which would be surprising.

Bottom line is you can keep an Oscar in a 35gal tank, but not for long. Not even 6 months. As suggested, bolivian rams would be a nice choice. They are very peaceful and non agressive towards other fish. Very colorful too!

Sponge

[sambi7878]

Oscars, green terror, and even jack dempsey needs to be in a 50 gal tank as what others may say. But I believe they can also live in a 35 gal tank alone.

Everyone is correct but I'll go with having rams. You can have a pair in your tank. Its a good size for a pair just provide a good hiding place for them and a good area to swim.

[Tanya81]

Hi,
I think some good ideas for you would be in the ram family! How about, Bolivian Rams, German Blue rams, Geophagus family work well in tanks under 55 gallons. Also Blue Acaras would look great in there too!! Try not to put any Dempseys, Terrors, Texas cichlids in there, oscars, as they will all get too big for that size. I hope this helps!

[Cosidius]

huh everyone forget about firemouths...? they only get like 6in and are beautiful and i tihnk shes looings for cichlids cichlids lke the aggresive ones...not rams and angels.....my .02

[Mobydock]

Originally Posted by sambi7878

Oscars, green terror, and even jack dempsey needs to be in a 50 gal tank as what others may say. But I believe they can also live in a 35 gal tank alone.

The problem is, that a healthy Oscar will reach a potential size of 14" in an appropriate size aquarium. If it's a standard 38G tank, than it's only 12-13" wide. Even if you somehow kept it in that size tank without stunting it's growth, the poor bugger wouldn't be able to turn around. A Jack Dempsey might be alright in that size tank(I would recommend 55G), but you could kiss your plants good bye; the same goes with Oscars, Green Terrors and pretty much every other highly agressive "Cichlid Cichlid".

Also just to add to my first post when I said if those are common plecos, you're already in trouble; they should grow 12"+. I don't know from first hand experience how much larger they get, but depending on where you're getting info, some say 2-3'.

[SpongeBob]

Words of wisdom MobyDock. Nice post.

Sponge

[Cliffizme2]

Originally Posted by Cosidius

...i tihnk shes looings for...

She? I am a "he".

Thanks for the responses, the more I read on here the more I think I want to get rid of my parrot cichlid and get some Africans. I think I'd rather have Africans if I can put more in a tank together and get some color, my plants might have to suffer.

[SpongeBob]

Don't forget that if you chose to change from American to African cichlids, you will need to change your substrate to crushed coral to help buffer your pH to 8.0 - 8.2. Furthermore, African are diggers and are very good at it, so forget plants in there. Not only would most of them get eaten, but also uprooted.

You will have to provide a rocky enviroment with at least ONE cave per fish. You may use clay pots that you break a bit to create an entrance.

One last thing, be careful not to mix fish from different lakes. There are 3 major lakes that provide African cichlids : Malawi, Tanganyika and Victoria. The most largely available are from Lake Malawi. BUT, in lake Malawi, you have the fish that live neer the cost, in the rocky environment and there are fish that live more towards the middle of the Lake, the Haplos. Both of them have different needs, such as food for instance. I would strongly suggest not mixing Haplos with costal dwellers. Some people do, but I don't think it's a good idea to mix fish that have such different needs. And PLEASE, don't rely on what you see in LFS tanks. They often mix Haplos with costal fish. They will even tell you that they go well together.

Bottom line, make a search on what kind of fish catches your eyes and then decide on what you wish to do. One good way is to find "THE FISH" you absolutely want and build the rest of the "pack" around it.

Good luck !

Sponge

[leveldrummer]

you dont have to use crushed coral, and you can mix from lakes just fine as long as you do your research, many of their needs arent that far apart (in the wild they are but your tanks is far from wild) ive kept a mixed mbuna tank, with comps and calvus for years on top of tahitian moon sand. no problems. easily done.

[Cosidius]

sorry firemouths are central my bad...ive kept africans for a long time without any special things just some kind of kent additive

[SpongeBob]

Originally Posted by leveldrummer

you dont have to use crushed coral, and you can mix from lakes just fine as long as you do your research, many of their needs arent that far apart (in the wild they are but your tanks is far from wild) ive kept a mixed mbuna tank, with comps and calvus for years on top of tahitian moon sand. no problems. easily done.

Agreed, you CAN do it. You can also keep an Oscar with Goldfish. Their chemistry needs are not that far apart. You could also use no substrate in mbuna tank and rely solely on pH buffers to maintain the pH at around 8.2. All those things will work.

But I thought that the goal of keeping fish is to keep them in the best conditions possible and those ideal conditions would be an exact or as close as you can possibly mimic their natural habitat. Mind you, to each is own. Just gave my view on the issue. But what you say is true, you can do it.

Sponge

[Georgia Peach]

I have an Malawi tank and I use regular gravel BUT my natural PH levels from my well are 7.6 and sometimes a bit higher. If you dont want to change substrate you need to make sure you keep something that is compatible to your tap PH levels. While you can change the PH to some degree - chemicals never work in the long run.

[leveldrummer]

not fighting you bob, just giving other options, it really does depend on tap water conditions, i too have high ph like peach, and that really makes a difference.