|
|
|||||||
Members currently in the Chat:8
|
|||||
 |
Users In Chat Room: mesapod, WildForFish, Buggy, JustOneMore20, lohachata, Ricker, wm_crash, Suess00 Come On In! |
||||
 |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
09-04-2006, 03:35 PM
|
#1 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
 |
auto top off
ok guys im looking at doing a project and an auto top off for it isnt a must, but it would make things so much easier...
heres what im thinking... simple bottle hanging upside down with some airline through the cap... the line suction cupped to the side of the tank with its end at the level i want the water to stay at... it would basically be like an auto fill dog dish...  here is the problem... as a levler.... it would work great... cant think of a single issue it would have with over filling or anything... but... when topping off salt water you use freshwater... if you have a tube of freshwater touching SW the salt will leech up the tube lowering the SG of the tank... granted if you have a small bottle relative to tank size even if they truely match sgs the efect on the main tank wil be minimal... you cant put SW in the bottle or you will increase your sg as the water evaporates... i guess im just gonna have to do an experiment and see how bad salt will leech up the tube... it might be slow enough not to even worry about it because of the downward flow when water refils the tank... anyone ever try this?... its sooo simple, but you never see it there has to be a reason you dont... and im guessing the salt mixing in your FW problem is y... i have an idea to over come this that is a simple valve to keep the waters seperate that i will try if i have to... here is a simple sketch...  basically a hard plastic straw with holes cross drilled in it... a float ball is suspended in the tube... when levels drop the ball will lower and fresh water will exit through the holes in the tube... when the level of the water raises above the holes the ball will float up and block off the fresh water from the sw reducing leeching... the ball is not designed to stop the water flow... the holes will do that the ball is simply there as a divider between SW and FW... i dont know if it will work, but hey its all about trial and error... -me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. Last edited by predator; 09-04-2006 at 03:39 PM. |
|
|
|
09-04-2006, 08:02 PM
|
#2 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
hmm alot of input im gettin here... i had another brainfart... as we know i need a way to use no motors or anything to regulate water level without the chace of salt seepage into the fresh water.... the only way to do this is to not allow the waters to touch...
here is my idea...  the theory behind it is when water levels drop the tube leading to the top of the bottle will drain and allow water air to enter the top of the bottle... this would allow water to drain from the bottom of the bottle... when the level gets to a point the shut off tube would begin picking up water and pull a vacuum on the bottle causing the water to stop draining from the tank refill tube... -me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
|
|
|
|
09-05-2006, 05:32 PM
|
#3 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
nothing from anyone?... not even "ummmmm never gonna work"... am i too unclear on it or just asking the wrong ppl or what?
-me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
|
|
|
|
09-05-2006, 08:35 PM
|
#4 |
|
Advisor to Neptune (Mod)
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Northern Illinois
Age: 40
Posts: 3,834
|
From what I see it should work. I just dont have saltwater tanks so I have no experience with topping off a tank and dealing with the weight of freshwater vs saltwater.
In basic understanding I would say saltwater would not go to far up the tube seeing how the actual physical weight of saltwater is heavier than freshwater. |
|
|
|
|
09-06-2006, 08:50 AM
|
#5 |
|
Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Age: 33
Posts: 98
|
I would just get a cheap check valve at the hardware store. That should solve the problem. PVC is probably pretty resistant to salt water. I must say that from your description and sketch I don't see how this is working or why the bottle isn't just dumping it's contents into the tank, but I'm sure there is something there I'm missing.
|
|
|
|
|
09-06-2006, 11:16 AM
|
#6 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
i too had thought about the check valve only problem with it its there has to be reverse flw up the tube... that is the only way air can get into the bottle and allow more water to exit...
and its the same basic concept as putting a cup under water and pulling it out upside down... it will hold the water until the seal around the lip is broken... -me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 08:20 AM
|
#7 |
|
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Age: 36
Posts: 177
|
The IV chingus you're rigging with "auto" fill is too much since the float has to move up and down for it to work however water will just dump out and emptying the whole thing since it's not water tight (and working against downward pressure). I see the concept of the salt water pushing up the float to put pressure on the downward push of the fill water but will there be enough upward pressure to have a good seal? I could see a rubber gasket above the floaty ball but again will there be enough upward pressure (better seal yes but?).
The whole thing reminds me of a "rodent" water bottle (you know the ones with two steel ball baring). Anyhow. The float has to be very (I mean extremely) buoyant to get a good seal. And the tollerances very tight or else it'll just empty out with out you wanting it to. As for it "leaching" I doubt it since Saltwater is denser than fresh water (think Jack Daniels floating on water or oil on top of water). And your last post. The cup holding water thing. It's a one shot deal since you'll have to calculate how much air comes in with the fill going out. Using gravity and vacuum will make a mess. Since they're hard to control. A mechanical valve shut off would make worlds easier. Get one of those 1/4 turn valves (for air line valves in commercial pet stores). They're chrome finished brass with a lever turn (not the round knob type) ball valve. I could see one of these with a float that is heavier so when the water level drops the weight of the float will turn the valve in turn filling the sump. As the level goes up so does the float and in turn sutting the valve off. Think the old toilet float system (ones on long arms). Come to think of it if you can rig the newer toilet float valve in to your "system" it might make it easier. (you can skip my elaborate valve system for one on your toilet).
__________________
It's only after we've lost everything, that we're free to do anything. |
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 11:49 AM
|
#8 | ||||
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
dont think you quite get it... though i thank you for your attempt...
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
i dont see how my second idea is a one shot deal... water cannot exit the bottle unless air (or some othere volume occupying material) is intering the bottle to take the place of the water... when the tube to the top is able to take in air that air will move to the top of the bottle and let out and amout of water... when the tube begins to draw water... the water column in the tube will pull a vacuum in the top of the bottle therefore shutting off the water exiting the bottle... (and it is impossible for water to get high enough to enter the bottle through the second tube... if this could happen you woudl have a perpetual machine...) and since water cannot be pulled high enough to replace the volume lost if fresh water exits the bottle and the water is blocking air from replacing the volume... you will form a vaccuum and the water will be held in... Quote:
-me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
||||
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 12:41 PM
|
#9 |
|
Trying Plants-help needed
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Fort Worth TEXAS, Cowtown USA
Age: 28
Posts: 54
 |
The last drawing looks like it should work, but it's simple enough to test in the sink with an empty soda bottle and a straw.
If I get a change I'll try it out tonight/this weekend I'll let you know what I find. (very nice idea btw)
__________________
Thanks, AndrewH |
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 01:59 PM
|
#10 |
|
Advisor to Neptune (Mod)
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Northern Illinois
Age: 40
Posts: 3,834
|
Maybe a cheap toilet float would work.
 Sorry couldn't resist. Actually I remember seeing somthing on the market that does this. I know this defeats the purpose of having a DIY section. But if I could remember where it was that I saw it someone could "reverse engineer" it and we could all benefit. 
|
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 04:44 PM
|
#11 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
ive been looking at nano tank stuff and havent seen one thats not electric or just based on dripping... non like this... and i just had a few minutes to brain fart on it...
-me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 04:53 PM
|
#12 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
im rigging it up right now....... ill let you know later if i can get he silicone dry tonight...
-me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 06:45 PM
|
#13 |
|
Advisor to Neptune (Mod)
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Northern Illinois
Age: 40
Posts: 3,834
|
Found one. A bit expensive.
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...m?pcatid=13959 also found this DIY model http://avdil.gtri.gatech.edu/RCM/RCM...illSystem.html |
|
|
|
|
09-07-2006, 08:19 PM
|
#14 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
see all electric... i want to figure out something that isnt... that works...
-me wish me luck im gonna lay around this weekend...
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
|
|
|
|
09-08-2006, 05:01 AM
|
#15 | |
|
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Age: 36
Posts: 177
|
Quote:
 . It's alway fun to tinker.
__________________
It's only after we've lost everything, that we're free to do anything. |
|
|
|
|
|
09-08-2006, 11:32 AM
|
#16 | |||||
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
oh by the way i tried the second one and couldnt get it to stop (got it to barely a trickle), but i had a small leak that im thinking caused this... (i know it had an effect) i did however pull water up the tube and get it to hold and "plug"... gonna reseal it tongit and try again... might ahve a working model as of saturday... when testing i had a small enough hole that no bubbles were comming in through the the exit hole... sure it all had to do with my leak... -me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. Last edited by predator; 09-08-2006 at 11:38 AM. |
|||||
|
|
|
|
09-09-2006, 03:06 PM
|
#17 |
|
Trying Plants-help needed
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Fort Worth TEXAS, Cowtown USA
Age: 28
Posts: 54
|
Well I just thought about this too... What about a simple pin hole in the bottle's lid then another one in the top of the battle (with the bottle being upside down)?
__________________
Thanks, AndrewH |
|
|
|
|
09-10-2006, 01:18 AM
|
#18 |
|
Pirates get all the booty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Little Rock, AR
Age: 25
Posts: 229
|
bottle would never stop drippin and unless the dripping was set up exatly perfect... you would prolly flood your tank...
-me
__________________
He spoke with the wisdom that can only come from experience, like a guy who went blind because he looked at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it and now goes around the country speaking at high schools about the dangers of looking at a solar eclipse without one of those boxes with a pinhole in it. |
|
|
|
|
09-19-2006, 08:19 PM
|
#19 |
|
Exotic Guru
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Somerset Ky
Age: 25
Posts: 113
 |
bro i have one that is NOT electric. Ill post pics tomorrow. its a CoralLife autotopoff. its basically, a small plastic thing with a float valve on it. I have my tank on a wall, that seperates the kitchen/living room. I ran the water line to the ice maker line.
Now, here may be the problem. Yes the water is cold, but with the autotop off only occuring in small amounts, and with my tank being a 220, that tiny amount of cold water doesnt make a difference. now for a smaller tank, i couldnt tell ya if it would make a difference or not. Also, you may say that the water from the ice maker is not dechlorinated. But, in small amounts its ok as your water conditioner does not vanish from the tank. As being part of a pet store for over 7 years, i have NEVER put water conditioner in my tanks when i top them off every other day, and ive never had a problem. Most of the tanks at the store, at least the freshwater ones, are 20l/25l's. An my saltwater ones are all over 55g. Now, im not saying you can, nor do i say i recommend that, but thats what ive done without problems. When doing a water change, yes i do use conditioner. Anyway back to the float valve, here is a basic drawing of what it looks like. 
__________________
Currently Setting up a 220g Saltwater. Check out the progress in the Picture section Equipment: Tidepool Sump, TurboTwist UV, Prism Skimmer,all in the works |
|
|
|
|
09-19-2006, 09:28 PM
|
#20 |
|
Exotic Guru
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Somerset Ky
Age: 25
Posts: 113
|
oh, and if price is the problem, i think this thing was only like $15
__________________
Currently Setting up a 220g Saltwater. Check out the progress in the Picture section Equipment: Tidepool Sump, TurboTwist UV, Prism Skimmer,all in the works |
|
|
|
