More than one way to skin a Nitrate?

[Vivid-Dawn]

I have looked through the posts within the last month (too lazy to go beyond that), and haven’t found anything regarding my specific concern. Here’s a background for replies:

Tank: 10 gallons (really only holds 8/30.25litres, though)
Fish: 3 Mollies, 3 guppies and 15 guppy fry in a breeder net
Plants: A few sprigs of Anacharis
Temp: 78 F / 25.5 C
PH: 7.6 (or above..I’m sure it’s off the chart, since the water goes immediately dark in my vial)
Ammonia: 0.25 ppm
Nitrites: 0.25 ppm
Nitrates: currently 20, but has been fluctuating between 10 and 50 for the last 2 weeks (which is what my question is about!)

The last 2 weeks, I’ve been doing 25% water changes twice a week. My water is tap water, with AmQuel Plus and Novaqua Plus added to it and let it sit for about 5 minutes.

Okay, so... I know that long-term exposure to Ammonia is bad. Also to Nitrates, which should stay 0-30ppm. It’s always been said that the best way to keep them down, is doing water changes - which is what I’ve been doing. So how come they’re at 40 or 50 every 3 days? Is there anything else I can do to lower them (and the Ammonia)?
I know plants like Nitrates, but every time I put plants in this tank, it dies... not enough light, I suppose. The few sprigs of anacharis, are doing alright, since they’re right under the bulb and trapped there by the breeding net.

[sumpthinfishy]

Nitrates are the byproduct of converting ammonia and nitrites in the nitrogen cycle. The more waste the more by-product. I think fry, having high metabolisms, make a good bit of waste. And if you're like me, you tend to overfeed, trying to make sure the babies have enough to eat. Well, okay. I overfeed everything! But I'd guess (no expert here) that lots of fish and baby fish, all getting plenty of food, is what's causing it.

I'm not familiar with AmQuel. So, I don't know how or if that might affect it.

I'm sure someone more knowledgeable than me will step in soon, though

[Damon]

The only natural way to remove nitrAtes is by using plants. Short of that, the only safe way to remove them is waterchanges. Some nitrate tests actually break the nitrate down to nitrite and then measures that, so since you have nitrites in your tank already you may be getting a false high reading.

[Vivid-Dawn]

My test kit (Aquarium Pharmaceuticals/Fish Doc) measures Nitrites and Nitrates separately. The Nitrites are always at about 0.25.

I do have quite a few plants I can put into my 10 gallon tank, except they won’t get enough light. I suppose I could try rigging up both bulbs to be over one tank, and that could work. Or, I could just move all my fry to the plant-only tank...They’d probably like that better, anyway!


Oddly enough, my husband’s 55g tank seems just fine. I don’t know what the levels are, because he never tests it. In fact, he doesn’t do anything but feed them and top-off evaporation! And all his fish are huge, and seemingly healthy...despite the fact he’s got 4 goldfish (one very large comet, the rest ‘feeders’ that survived), a 7 inch Pleco and it’s overstocked. It’s frustrating that my fish are shimmying, or die ever so often, and I try so hard to take decent care of them... he does nothing, and they thrive! He has no plants, too...

[sumpthinfishy]

Now, when he wasn't looking, I'd HAVE to test his water just to see! That would drive me crazy! LOL

How long have you had the tank up and running? It may be up there and I've overlooked it, but I called myself reading them all. Is it still cycling or has it completed the cycling process and this is something new that's popped up?

I think what Simpte was saying is that your test may be reading some of the nitrates as nitrites and that's why you've got nitrites at all. But I could be discombobulated due to lack of sleep.

I'd try not doing the AmQuel and other chemicals, except what you need to remove chloramines from water and do frequent water changes to keep all the levels safe for a bit. See if that affects your readings drastically. And if you do feed alot, cut back on that a bit for nitrate control (all of it really).

And I think the fry would like the plant only tank. But you'd have to cycle again! LOL Can't win for losing, huh?

[TheOldSalt]

Like we discussed before, the Amquel is messing up your test results, so there's no telling what the levels really are without it.
Just add more light and plants, or move the fry to the plant tank.

[MyraVan]

I'm setting up a new 10 gallon tank and have bought a 24W compact flouresent fixture for it. Have you thought about one of those to help your plants grow? Since my tank is 18" long, CF is the only sensible way to light it. I can't even put a 15W normal tube in it, since they are 18" long on their own!

[Vivid-Dawn]

Whoops, maybe I didn't put enough info up.

My 10 gallon tank has been running since January, and I'd hope it's cycled by now. I think it might be the fry after all, because before they were born, everything was just fine. My plant tank (2.5 gallons) technically is cycled, even though it's only been up 2 weeks...all levels are 0, and I think that's because it's FULL of plants (I have 2 bunches of 3 different kinds of plants). The only reason I didn't cycle it, is because people at a plant forum said it wouldn't need it with all that foliage...and it seems they're right.

I test my water before the change of treated water (it needs it, our tap water is disgusting - tasting and looking!). So I doubt my AmQuel/Novaqua are offsetting it. I change the water every 3-4 days... but maybe I'll start doing a 10% water change every day, rather than 30% every 4 days... it's about the same amount, just divided up a bit.

This is why I haven't set up my "guppy farm" yet.. I'm practicing with them in a regular tank first, to get all the tricks down pat.

I think I'll just move my babies to the little tank, and see if that helps.

[MyraVan]

My plant tank (2.5 gallons) technically is cycled, even though it's only been up 2 weeks...all levels are 0, and I think that's because it's FULL of plants (I have 2 bunches of 3 different kinds of plants). The only reason I didn't cycle it, is because people at a plant forum said it wouldn't need it with all that foliage...and it seems they're right.

Er, but your little tank is a plant-only tank, right? If so, then of course ammonia and nitrite are 0, since you don't have a source of ammonia in there. The beneficial bacteria will start to grow when you add your ammonia source.

About not needing cycling when you have lots of plants... My 5 gallon office tank had loads of plants from the very start, as well as some floating plants (hornwort). I added two snails for cycling. The plants absorbed most of the excess ammonia while the filter bacteria were getting going, but during the cycing (which took about three or four weeks) the ammonia and nitrite levels did get up to 0.5ppm. This is not much for a cycling tank, but it's more than 0, which is what you have for a cycled tank. So if you put your guppy fry into your 2.5gallon plant-only tank, I woudln't be surprised if you do get some ammonia and nitrite readings, although they should be alot lower than if you had put them into a new, unplanted tank.

[Vivid-Dawn]

It was going to be an all-plant tank, but I decided to put a couple Zebra Danios in there (I chose them because I've heard they're the hardiest for if it did cycle). I also moved 3 of the older fry in there, as I figure it's about time to start seperating males and females.
And yes, the first week it did a little cycle. My Ammonia got 1.0ppm at the highest, and my Nitrates never got above 5.0 - but since the 9th day or so, it's all been at 0.0

But like I said, it's jam-packed with plants. There's hardly any "free" room for the fish, except in the corners of the tank. I'm debating setting up some sort of 'fence' made out of drinking straws for them... but maybe they like darting in and out of the foliage.

I have 2 bunches of each
"Anacharis" - Egeria densa
"Cabomba" - Cabomba caroliniana
"Frill" - myriophyllum scabratum

[atltk]

How about just getting new, low-light-tolerant plants (there are a few out there)?

[MyraVan]

Ah, I see! Now that your little almost-all-plant-tank has cycled, may I respectfully suggest putting the zebra danios somewhere else? They are very fast swimmers, and I strongly suspect that the tiny tank they are in won't give them the space they need for swimming. Maybe you could put the fry in at the same time as you take the zebras out, so that the beneficial bacterial you've built up won't be lost.

(We have a half-dozen zebras in our 20 gallon tank at home, and I've grown to quite an admirer of these little fish.)

[Vivid-Dawn]

I probably will do that, actually. I figured just 2 would be okay in that tank...but they DO dart around a lot, especially when I feed 'em.
I'm gonna set up a 20 gallon tank this weekend...which has to cycle. I wonder if I could use them for that, or wait. It's a tough decision, between them getting exposed to all those chemical fluxations, or being cramped. Bleh!

Sometimes owning fish is as frustrating as it is nice and theraputic LOL

[MyraVan]

Can you find some floating plants to put into your 20 gallon while you're cycling it? The zebras haven't had much exposure to nasty chemicals since the first tank they cycled had so many plants, and if you use plants again they will be similarly protected the second time around. I use hornwort for breaking in new tanks; because we have hard water it grows like crazy.