Tropical Strays

[Scuba Kid]

in late summer and fall here in new england, currents bring juvenile tropical fish from the gulf of mexico up here. i take this opportunity to snorkel and catch what i can with a hand net. i have a 40 gallon specifically set up for this purpose. last thursday, i had a great day of collecting. this is what i have collected so far:

1 short bigeye
2 boxfish
1 spotfin butterfly fish
2 snowy groupers
1 golden jack
1 unknown species of filefish
3 unknown fish, which kind of look like banded pilotfish. except for the fact that they are yellowish...not white

now i have had problems feeding the tropical fish i have caught before...and this time is no different. for some of them. most fish are eating brineshrimp and blackworms, but here are the fish that are not eating:

butterflyfish
boxfish
golden jack

i tried the brineshrimp and blackworms for these guys and i also tried baby brine shrimp, but they didnt take any of it. however, the butterfly has been pecking at some orange sponge.

does anyone have any ideas as to what i could try to get these 3 fish to eat what i give them?

Thanks,
Katie

[wrasser]

Try mysis shrimp, frozen is ok, just hold the cube in front of the in let of the tank and it will thaw out and dispurce the shrimp through out the tank

[TheOldSalt]

Chopped up Aiptasia anemones make great Butterfly chow, along with blackworms.
The boxfish should eat anything in sight.
The jack should be a problem until it figures out what fishfood is, and they are a bit sensitive to being moved anyway.

A picture would of course make ID'ing your mystery fish much easier.

[Scuba Kid]

the boxfish are ow eating brineshrimp! i moved them into a breeder net because i think the other fish were not letting them eat. they ate after i moved them.
i think i found out that "mystery" fish are banded rudderfish but i will post pics ASAP.

[TheOldSalt]

Rudderfish were what I suspected they were from your prior description, so if you think so too, that's probably it.

[Scuba Kid]

finally took some pics. im hoping some people can me identify some of them.

sorry for this blurry pic. my camera sucks. i think it is a juvenile cube boxfish but im not positive. it has little black spots, which you cant tell from the pic.


golden jack maybe?


snowy grouper.



short bigeye.


anyone have any idea what kind of filefish this is?


rudderfish maybe? and a spotfin butterflyfish


rudderfish again.


-Katie

[Scuba Kid]

by the way, everything is now eating except the butterflyfish. i tried aiptasia anemones and blackworms, along with the adult and baby brineshrimp. the only thing it is eating is an orange sponge we put in the tank for decor. it's constantly pecking at it, but it wont take anything else. i did not try mysis shrimp yet. hafta take a trip to the lfs.

[TheOldSalt]

I'm pretty sure those are juvenile Rudderfish alright, but I can't tell which Jack you have.
The filefish is Aluterus schoepfi.
The boxfish is Lactophrys bicaudalis. Hang onto it, for it'll be a spectacular adult.
The Butterfly should figure out how to eat eventually. If it doesn't, consider letting it go. A freshwater dip serves as an appetite stimulant sometimes.

[euRasian32]

WOW.

Katie: I admire your fascination and dedication. I have to say I'm a little jealous. I really should get certified, opposed to waiting until I retire or when my residual income is 24/7. I'm all out of excuses.

[Scuba Kid]

thanks eurasian. i love collecting and i love the success of keeping them healthy even more.

TheOldSalt: thanks very much for identifying thosefish! and, what is a freshwater dip? sorry, i didnt understand what you meant by this. also, i have another boxfish with the exact same shape, but it is brown, and may have tiny little white spots. is this the same species with a different color pattern, or something else?

Thanks,

-Katie

[Scuba Kid]

oh, and theoldsalt: the tropicals are here to stay and die over winter, which is why i cant let anything go. ill try the mysis shrimp and "freshwater dip" (once i find out what that is, lol) and maybe if i find another butterflyfish or create a small group, i will have better results. i will also add a small piece of live rock and maybe it will peck at this.

[TheOldSalt]

Did you chop up the Aiptasia anemone for the butterfly? Mincing it into itty bitty bits makes them very appealing as a butterfly snack.

A freshwater dip is a procedure in which the fish is dumped into a bucket of fresh water of the same pH & temp which is fully aerated. This is primarily used to destroy gill/external parasites, but a side effect is appetite stimulation. Different fish have different tolerances for freshwater dips, but three minutes is as long enough. Openwater smoothskinned fish like jacks are not good at surviving dips, but a butterfly would have no problems.

The boxfish is probably another Lactophrys, but there are so many of these guys in the brown color as juveniles that I couldn't guess which one you have. All the Lactophrys tend to look pretty cool as adults. By the way, they are cowfishes, not boxes, but when that young they certainly pass for boxes.

[Scuba Kid]

okay, thanks.

i tried my best to chop up the anemone...i think ill probably try it again.
also, one more question on the dip. do you mean fresh saltwater, or actual freshwater? if you mean actual freshwater...that would scare me a bit to do that... how long do i dip it?

[Fishfirst]

what about clams/scallops halves? I hear they stimilate feeding in butterflyfishes.

[TheOldSalt]

Actual fresh water. The fish themselves like to take freshwater baths in the wild whenever they find a supply of fresh water. It hydrates them and makes their parasites either burst or at least swell up so much that they can't stay attached.
2-3 minutes is plenty, actually close to the safe limit for many fish.
NOTE: do not use water which has been dechlorinated with chemicals. These chemicals cause very rapid slime production in the fish, and this slime defeats the purpose of the dip by shielding the skin & the parasites from the fresh water.

Split open bivalves sometimes work, sure, and they're certainly worth a try, but I've personally had much better luck with a glob of ground up blackworms & anemones, preferably with some sort of frozen food ( fully thawed ). Such a presentation evokes a feeding frenzy among the fishes in the tank, and the butterflies eventually join in the fun. I should mention that this only goes for Atlantic butterflies, and that those obligate corallivores of the pacific won't touch this stuff.

[redpaulhus]

I just found this... i was gonna mention cut open fresh live clams (quahogs, mahogony clams, etc) but somebody beat me to it.

I second Oldsalts suggestion of worms and anemones. I've also had decent luck taking a blender, adding some shrimp, squid, and clams, and blending into a thick "goop" - not too runny, keep it fairly chunky. I then press this stuff into pieces of coral, or shells, or even tuffa rock - something with enough texture to hold it a bit, not too smooth. I then freeze it for a little while (so it holds together when I put it in the tank) and drop in the tank. (sometimes I have to loop an elastic around it, or mesh from an onion bag, but if I get the consitancy right it doesn't start floating away till its getting nibbled on)...

How little are all these guys ? they look small in the pics... less than 3" ?

[Scuba Kid]

the butterfly fish is dime sized. ive had some losses...probably from the tank being overcrowded... i lost the bigeye (very upset about this one), a rudderfish, and the jack. i did a partial water change, maybe 25%.
ill try that idea. sounds good! thanks.

-Katie