Woot! Getting some new puffies!

[Puffer Pita]

For several months now, there have been a couple of T.baileyi puffers at my LFS. They are simply adorable, but because of the price ($169 and $139), there's no way I could get them. A few weeks ago, I figured I had nothing to lose so I asked one of the staff to ask the owner/manager if he'd be willing to come down a little on the price. Well, he finally called me back today and said after thinking about it a couple of weeks and talking to his staff members about me (they have gotten to know me pretty well), he decided that he didn't need them for display purposes and they've had them long enough for anyone who was interested in buying them to do so, so he's willing to give me quite a good discount on one, and even better discount if I get both. So I talked to my hubby about it and he said we could get both!! WOOT!!!

So I talked to the owner/manager again and he said it wouldn't be a problem for them to hold the puffs for another two weeks while I get my tank set up. I have a 55g tank with stand and canopy, and bought a canister filter on Ebay that, coicidently, arrived today. All I need to get is a heater, as I think we have enough substrate laying around for it.

I'm sooo excited!!

[Kindredfyre]

I recently found the cute little puffers myself. I've been eyeing one at my LFS and got him on Sat. Just a little freshwater dwarf puffer - really cute! I'm sure yours are saltwater? I would love to have a dogface puffer someday, but not enough time to devote to a saltwater tank. congrats and good luck!

[Puffer Pita]

I have one saltwater puffer, a GSP, the rest are all freshwater.

What tank setup do you have for your DP and how did you cycle it? You do know that they should not be in a tank with any other fish, yes?

[Kindredfyre]

Yes - I'm setting up a new tank for my catfish so he'll have this tank all to himself in another week. I have it set up with a couple fake plants, a fake coral stucture with little hiding spots in it. The "turtle cave" will be taken out when my other tank gets set up as that is the catfish's cave, a bubble wand that makes little bubbles every now and then, and another neat rock formation with hiding spots in it. I always see him darting in and out of the formations there and hiding in the plant. The catfish doesn't come out and when he does, he stays on the bottom.
I just checked the levels this morning and everything is perfect! I also added a little aquarium salt as I read somewhere they do better with it. Since I added that, the catfish actually seems more active.... hmmm. Salt doesn't hurt them as long as you don't dump a whole bunch in. Do you know of a place I can buy tiny pond snails maybe online? I can't find any anywhere!

[JustOneMore20]

Boxermom, show us some pictures when you get your puffers!

Kindred, get more than one DP...they are social fish. Usually a lone DP doesn't do well.

[Kindredfyre]

Ah ok... someone also just told me not to put a little aquarium salt in with him as they don't like it... does anyone know if this is true or not? So many conflicting theories and books! I think I'll get another little one for him.
Here's a dumb question, how can you tell a male from a female puff?

[Kindredfyre]

oh and yes, we need pics boxer! = )

[Puffer Pita]

Ok, first thing, no salt. None. Unless you are treating for ick, DPs should not be salted.

Second, DPs are not "social." They will often tolerate others of the same species, but as often as not, they won't. If you are going to get multiples, they need at least 3 gallons each, tons of plants and other decor, and should be either all male, all female or 1:3 m/f ratio. Even then there are no guarantees.

Last, DPs are one of the few that can be sexed. The only sure way to tell is the eye wrinkles. Most males also develop a dark line on their belly but not all do, and sometimes females will as well. But only males get wrinkles behind their eyes. However, they are usually sold in stores several months before they are old enough to get them. So if you get one that has them, you know its a male. If it doesn't have them, its either a female or a male too young to have developed them.

I recommend www.dwarfpuffers.com for much information and discussion on DPs.

[JustOneMore20]

They may not be "social" but I have heard many times when kept alone they stop eating.

Puffers prefer company and don't eat as well alone. Sometimes a lone puffer will never come around to eating frozen food. My first one had that problem and I found a 5g is usually too small for 2. They are more likely to go after other fish in the tank or tear things up if kept alone and especially if kept alone in small tanks. It's rarely suggested by good puffer keepers that you keep just one dwarf puffer

A girl on another forum I visit regularly had problems keeping a lone puffer. I've also heard of them not eating, while alone from more than one person. They learn from each other and will do much better in groups. They will most likely take a wider variety of food in larger groups. I trust her information because she is a very experienced fish keeper. Other people on the same forum gave the same advice...don't keep them alone.

They are best kept in ratios of atleast 2-3 females to 1 male in a 10g tank minimum IMO. I'd even suggest you get a 20g and have 6 of them, that way you will have a better chance of getting good male:female ratios (if you can't tell them apart).

[Puffer Pita]

I belong to several puffer-specific forums, including one specifically about DPs and I've never heard anything about them not eating or having any problems whatsoever when kept alone. I've never once seen any experienced, "good" puffer keepers (who have literally decades of experience with puffers) recommend that they be kept in groups as opposed to solo. I have, however, often seen them recommend one for a 5 gallon tank.

I've done quite a lot of research on various puffers, and have never read anything about them having problems when alone or needing to be in groups. That's simply not true. There are many, many people who keep just one and they are fine, healthy and doing quite well. Conversely, there are many who have had problems keeping several of them together, even in a larger tank, due to the aggression and territoriality of DPs.

DPs can and do shred fish that are MUCH larger than themselves. They often go after other fish if they are the sole puffer, but they will also go after other fish if there are several puffers. They are no more likely or unlikely to do so whether in groups or alone, its highly dependent upon their individual personalities. That is why we always recommend puffers be in species-only tanks.

A 10g tank should have no more than 3 puffers in it, regardless of sex. I would not recommend 4 in a 10. They have a very heavy bioload and require overfiltration, on top of the territorial/aggression issues.

[Dr_House]

I've never known Boxermom to be wrong when she talks about puffers. If the title "guru" doesn't apply, it's a very close fit.

[j55]

what puffer is good for a beginer (with puffers)

i have a 48" x 15" x 18" tank to be set up and i am just looking for ideas, what pufer is good to go in with other fish (FW)

[JustOneMore20]

I've never known Boxermom to be wrong when she talks about puffers. If the title "guru" doesn't apply, it's a very close fit.

I did research on DPs before because I was going to keep some in my 10g (when it was empty). I asked on another forum and got loads of help and advice from people that keep them. They gave me their experiences and maybe its not the "correct" information, but it had worked for them. They had successfully kept DPs before. And no it wasn't a puffer forum, but it was one that I trusted most of the information given on it.

I'm not here to argue, I just wanted to tell the person what I had been told about them. I don't belong to any puffer websites and I don't claim to be a know it all, but I did some research before so I'm not totally stupid.

[Puffer Pita]

Originally Posted by j55

what puffer is good for a beginer (with puffers)

i have a 48" x 15" x 18" tank to be set up and i am just looking for ideas, what pufer is good to go in with other fish (FW)

NO puffer is good to go with other fish. You can occasionally find one that gets long with others, but that's an exception to the rule. We (responsible puffer keepers) recommend species-only tanks for puffers.

[Dr_House]

so I'm not totally stupid.

Well, so much for my "you're totally stupid" argument.

All I'm saying is Boxermom is a member of numerous puffer forums, has quite a few puffers herself, and is obsessive about researching them. Knowing what I do of her, I would take her advice without question.

If a situation in one person's aquarium can't be reliably duplicated in another, it bears mentioning that, while they may try it this way, they're likely to have better results doing it another.

[Scuba Kid]

Originally Posted by Boxermom

NO puffer is good to go with other fish.

This isn't true. Saltwater puffers are kept with other large semi-aggressive fish all the time, with success. Dog Face, Stars and Stripes, and sometimes porcupine and burrfish are kept in large tanks with large tankmates (angels, triggers, etc), and some like the valentini puffer and tobies are quite good with tankmates.
I have found through my experience and research, however, that most freshwater puffers tend to be harrassing fin-nippers or even down right aggressive and best kept alone.

[j55]

so if i was to put 1 puffer in a 4', (49gallon) what would be the biggest puffer i could put in?

[Scuba Kid]

Probably a hairy puffer, but they come with a heavy price tag usually. I'm not even sure if a 49 gallon is big enough for one, but i would assume it is as i think they get about 7 inches.

[Durbkat]

I'm not sure if you said this already boxermom but how much is he selling them both for now?

[Puffer Pita]

Hairy puffers are pretty rare, too. Durb, my hairy puffers are still over $100 each even with the discount.

If you ONLY have the puffer in there, you could get a congo, suvatti, palembang, turgirdis or Fang's puffer.

Scuba Kid, you are correct that sometimes SW puffers can have a variety of tankmates. But its also highly dependent upon the individual puffer and just as many will not tolerate tankmates. However, he specified FW in his post so that's what I was assuming he meant, as well as mentioned "for beginners." I wouldn't recommend any SW puffer for a beginner.